00:00:00:04 - 00:00:13:21 Speaker 1 This is Rosanne Gomez conducting an interview for the Speedway at Wimbledon or Wimbledon Stadium oral History project on the 21st of April 2026. Could you tell me your full name, please? 00:00:13:23 - 00:00:15:14 Speaker 2 Jonathan Stevens. 00:00:15:20 - 00:00:17:11 Speaker 1 And where were you born? 00:00:17:12 - 00:00:21:00 Speaker 2 I was born May Day Hospital, Croydon, actually. 00:00:21:01 - 00:00:22:22 Speaker 1 So what year were you born? 00:00:22:23 - 00:00:24:04 Speaker 2 1983. 00:00:24:05 - 00:00:26:20 Speaker 1 And what did your parents do for a living? 00:00:26:22 - 00:00:36:21 Speaker 2 My dad's electrical engineer, and my mum was a insurance and pensions adviser. 00:00:36:23 - 00:00:41:04 Speaker 1 Could you give us a brief overview of how speedway works? 00:00:41:06 - 00:01:11:00 Speaker 2 So, speedway. Well, it's a very unique sport really, because it's motorsport and team sport. 500 cc bikes with outbreaks going anti-clockwise around an oval circuit within sort of meters of each other in front of thousands of fans. It's unique in the fact it's, as I said, as my description just a moment ago, but as I said, being a team sport and a motor sport, it's very unique and it's normally held within city centers. 00:01:11:02 - 00:01:14:19 Speaker 2 So get good crowds to speedway. 00:01:14:21 - 00:01:19:18 Speaker 1 Could you tell us a bit about the rules and the scoring and how the teams are made up? 00:01:19:19 - 00:01:40:18 Speaker 2 Okay, yeah. So as I said, speedway is a team sport and the race in leagues. So predominantly you have seven seven people in a team and then you race against someone else from another part of the country that's got seven seven people in the team. You have 15 races in a meeting and you get points in each race. 00:01:40:18 - 00:02:06:16 Speaker 2 So if you win a race, you get three points a second, you get two points, third you get one point and if you come last you get zero. Now when you race, you normally race with your team mate. So there's two members of one team and then two members of the other team racing the same race. So typically if you add the scores together, if the home rider was to finish first and second, that's five points and the away rider one point. 00:02:06:17 - 00:02:31:14 Speaker 2 So it would be called A51. If the home rider finishes first and the other home rider finishes third and the away rider mixes between them, then it's A42, and if the scores are even meaning one of the riders, one erase and then the other two from the opposing team have come second and third. It's free all. So total total throughout the meeting is 90 points up for grabs. 00:02:31:15 - 00:02:51:14 Speaker 2 So if it's a draw, it's a 4545 and anything difference. Obviously a win is a win and a loss is a loss. And those points add up to in the league table. And then at the end of the season you have a playoff. So very similar to football, rugby and other sports when it comes to team team racing that's how it works. 00:02:51:14 - 00:03:11:11 Speaker 2 And then you would face each other at least once or twice in the season. Season runs from March to October. So that's that's speedway in a nutshell. There is world championship, which is individual, but Wimbledon predominantly was a team, team, club, and we always raced in the British League. 00:03:11:13 - 00:03:18:16 Speaker 1 Could you tell us what the advantages might be of if you write on your home ground? 00:03:18:18 - 00:03:46:09 Speaker 2 Yes. So speedway tracks are all different sizes. So what we call home advantage. So predominantly it's 400m. So you know sort of the size of an athletics track. But some tracks are smaller. Some tracks are 280m which is considerably lot smaller and others are over 400. So you might go to one place in Manchester and then you would race down in Devon, Plymouth, and the tracks are totally different. 00:03:46:09 - 00:04:16:01 Speaker 2 So you would then create a home advantage. If you race every week, your home meetings, you get used to the style of track, the way it rides and the setup of the bike, whereas the home, the away riders, sorry when they turn up to the event and the meeting, they may only visit there once or twice and sometimes it can up, you know, different setups with bikes and cause issues for riders, which makes the dynamics of a speedway meeting really interesting. 00:04:16:03 - 00:04:17:24 Speaker 2 Yeah. 00:04:18:01 - 00:04:21:07 Speaker 1 Could you take us through what the rules are of a race? 00:04:21:08 - 00:04:46:12 Speaker 2 So yeah. So as I said, there's 15 races in the meeting. The riders are there, all managed by a referee, a referee that oversees the whole meeting under the Speedway Control board. So there's tight restrictions. The referee normally gives them two minutes to get to the tapes, which is the starting tapes. Tapes, which are the two white bands at the start line. 00:04:46:13 - 00:05:10:20 Speaker 2 And when they race up, that's the start of the race. So they have two minutes to get to to the start position. And then predominantly the race is lost for about 60s, give or take a little bit. And then when they come back in, as the program reads, you'd alternate your riders and then maybe that rider will probably have a break for 2 or 3 races, and then he'll be going back out. 00:05:10:22 - 00:05:38:23 Speaker 2 And that goes throughout the whole evening. There's normally an interval, a bit like football, and then the scores are totaled at the end and everyone has to adhere to the rows. There's certain rules for if you touch the tapes, the starting tapes, it's a starting offense. And they can either be excluded or have to go back certain meter to give them adequate disadvantage, or the fact that they hit the tapes. 00:05:39:00 - 00:05:54:20 Speaker 2 And then there's on the last lap of every race, there's a yellow and black cross which the marshal waves. That means there's one lap to go. And obviously the checkered flag means what it means. It means that's the final lap and you've won the race. So yeah, that's that's Speedway rules in a nutshell. 00:05:55:00 - 00:06:00:19 Speaker 1 That's brilliant. Thank you. Could you tell us about the origins of speedway in Wimbledon. 00:06:00:21 - 00:06:32:10 Speaker 2 So Wimbledon Speedway started in May 1920. May bank holiday in 1928. Now there is a story to this because the stadium was being built by a company who the the Kearns company that were building it for an American company to introduce greyhound racing, which as we know was a new sport in the UK, come from America. And the stadium builders hadn't been paid for that work. 00:06:32:11 - 00:07:14:18 Speaker 2 So Roger Kearns is great, grandfather decided, well, if the American companies are going to pay me for the the works that we've done and constructed this amazing still still structure, which in 1928 was quite something, really, he took it on and that's how Wimbledon Stadium started. And then the speedway being introduced from Australia in 1928. Wimbledon was one of the first tracks in London to be to be established as a speedway team, and with the facilities already in place for greyhounds, it blended itself as a unique place, an ideal place to host speedway within the capital. 00:07:14:20 - 00:07:18:03 Speaker 1 Can you tell us about the origins of the colors? 00:07:18:05 - 00:07:46:05 Speaker 2 Right, so as I'm interested in Wimbledon Speedway's history and a historian and I have searched high and low for the reason why we use red and yellow and why we use the star now. Roger. Sorry. Ronnie Green, who was the promoter in the in the 30s, introduced the yellow star on the red scarlet background. Why that is, I don't know. 00:07:46:06 - 00:08:10:01 Speaker 2 I still to this day have not been able to find out if anyone knows the the answer. Please get in touch because we don't know the definitive answer to that, unfortunately. But it's history is really interested in social history, sport and history that as you talk to new people, different people, you find out new information and every day is a school day so you can find out something new. 00:08:10:05 - 00:08:16:03 Speaker 2 And I'm the first one to want to know what the answer is to that. Yeah. 00:08:16:05 - 00:08:22:15 Speaker 1 Could you tell us about the popularity over the years, including the media coverage? 00:08:22:17 - 00:08:46:08 Speaker 2 Yes. So we've been introduced in 1928. It was introduced to a place called High Beach in Essex. The first meeting in February 28th. No one knew anything about it. No one anticipated who would turn up. They thought maybe 2000 people would turn up at a push. It was advertised in motorcycle magazines at the time, in excess of 20,000 people turned up. 00:08:46:08 - 00:09:16:12 Speaker 2 So it was unprecedented times and a bit of a surprise, really. Johnny Hoskins, who bought it from Australia, found himself to have this sport that the media just grabbed. It was on the front page of the daily, Daily Mirror or Daily Herald at the time, and they basically had this new craze, you know, between the war years, people wanted to the combustion engine was, was, you know, and motorbikes were pioneering at the time, seen as fast, noisy and exciting. 00:09:16:12 - 00:09:49:03 Speaker 2 And I think people like that. So with that in mind, tracks opened up all over the place in London, particularly Stamford Bridge, Crystal Palace, exhibition Grounds, then Wimbledon, Harringay, West Ham. There was this whole network of tracks in London alone, plus the other tracks up in the north of England, and with that became popularity and the media. Obviously with the war years, there was no speedway and then postwar people were after they were wanted to do something, you know, with their time. 00:09:49:03 - 00:10:18:03 Speaker 2 We'd spent, you know, a lot of years in the doldrums and people wanted to go out and see live entertainment again. They wanted to see the thrills and spills, the speedway. So in the late 40s, going into the early 50s, speedway was very popular again, all over London, all over the UK. And with that, you know, it was it was not uncommon for crowds to be 20,000, 30,000 at Wimbledon versus, you know, Wembley, you're talking 80,000. 00:10:18:04 - 00:10:40:17 Speaker 2 And some people locked out the stadium. So local derbies that you have now Arsenal versus Chelsea, it was very, very similar in speedway terms back in the 40s. And as we come away from the war years and postwar years, people, then you had pop music, you had cinemas, you had a variety television come about. So you had so much choice on offer. 00:10:40:17 - 00:11:00:15 Speaker 2 And people started to dwindle away from the speedway in the 60s, although it still had popularity, and lots of tracks were based in London and were over the UK and they still had good attendances, it was much less than what it was previous years, so there was a sort of highs and lows of speedway and the media coverage has followed. 00:11:00:15 - 00:11:22:01 Speaker 2 So with that as well, in the 70s they had a TV contract with the World of Sport, Dickie Davis, and we had a world champion in Peter Collins in 76. And you had corporate and commercial companies getting involved, cigarette companies, they even took it to Dubai. So there was great hope in the 70s for an expansion in speedway. 00:11:22:04 - 00:11:44:06 Speaker 2 And again, history sort of repeats itself. It's gone up and down, up and down. And at the moment we're in this sort of middle, middle, middle period and lack in media coverage, lack in TV coverage. In this day and age, it's a kind of dog eat dog. And if you're not getting the coverage, you're going to get forgotten about Speedway's unique. 00:11:44:07 - 00:12:07:14 Speaker 2 It's really snapshot, really quick. 60s I think now we live in an era of people want a quick, quick action. It's great for TV because you can have commercial breaks. So it's kind of it's UK is it's the hidden gem, the sport of speedway. Yeah. 00:12:07:16 - 00:12:13:15 Speaker 1 Could you tell us about the legends of Wimbledon including anybody local and international. 00:12:13:16 - 00:12:37:22 Speaker 2 As well. Yeah. So Ronnie Green was was it was the promoter pre-war and postwar. And he held that position for a number of years. He was an astute businessman. He kept the club going and they were financially successful and they were successful on track. So he's he's one person that he's not a rider, but he's one of the backroom management that could be forgotten about Ronnie Green. 00:12:37:24 - 00:13:14:22 Speaker 2 Now he introduced other riders throughout the at these times, Ronnie Moore being one of them. In the 50s. He went on to race only for Wimbledon. He dedicated his whole racing career in the UK to Wimbledon and become double world champion, so he was a mainstay of the Wimbledon team for many years, along with Cyril Bryan, the Bryan family heavily involved with Wimbledon Speedway pre-war in the 30s, and Post and Cyril rode for the club for a number of years, and I believe he holds one of the highest appearance and points, scoring four for Wimbledon. 00:13:14:22 - 00:13:46:06 Speaker 2 So Cyril Bryan's one to to to remember there. Along with Roger Johns, Roger Johns started late 60s early 70s and through till the late 80s. So again he held the club record throughout that period. So you've got different riders from different periods. Typically a rider will race for ten, 15, maybe 20 years maybe. So you've got periods where riders raced that were the heroes of the fans of that time. 00:13:46:11 - 00:14:08:01 Speaker 2 Tommy Janssen was another rider that unfortunately, his career got cut short with being killed in an accident in Sweden. And again, he was he was the pin up of the pinup boy of of the Pit Bend Loonies at Wimbledon. So dashing Swedish rider had a lot of skill and most importantly, he he got on well with the fans. 00:14:08:01 - 00:14:34:03 Speaker 2 And that's very unique with speedways that the fans have easy access to the riders. They're very accessible after the meeting, before the meeting. So you're fine. You found and you do find to this day that fans know the riders on a personal level and the riders interact with them. So there is a lot of riders that are I could name that represented Wimbledon, Trevor Hedge as well. 00:14:34:04 - 00:14:56:04 Speaker 2 He's another another rider that gave a lot to to Wimbledon throughout his career as well. To the extent I believe that on his wedding night he actually raced for Wimbledon, him and Pam got to the stadium on their wedding night and raced for Wimbledon. That is dedication, isn't it? You know. So yeah. 00:14:56:06 - 00:15:05:10 Speaker 1 Could you give us a chronology of Wimbledon Speedway describing the rise and fall? I know you've done that a little with the popularity. 00:15:05:12 - 00:15:32:00 Speaker 2 Yes. So as I said, when Wooden speedway as a club took an opportunity in the 19 late 20s and 30s, brand new stadium and they formed the club there, it was a new craze, sport, and Wimbledon was part of the point. They were one of the pioneer clubs and as the club we went through post postwar period, we were Wimbledon kept up with that popularity. 00:15:32:00 - 00:15:51:11 Speaker 2 They were the glamor club. It was the club that everyone wanted to race for. It was racing in one of the best stadiums, you know, where could you go to Speedway? How? And have a free course, you know, silver service dinner behind glass, not get covered in shell or the smell and dirt of speedway. You had the option to do that and stand outside. 00:15:51:11 - 00:16:31:16 Speaker 2 But there was no way. I don't believe in the UK which you had them, plus facilities that Wimbledon had and the accessibility with the tube and the bus network close by. Wimbledon was just so key to British Speedway and in light of the popularity of speedway, I would say that Wimbledon speedway suffered when Tommy Hanson died because of such a rider that was well known to the fans and kind of like, you know, their heart being ripped out with, with the the death of Tommy, it really didn't help the club at all. 00:16:31:18 - 00:16:55:10 Speaker 2 They were going places. He was he was going to be world champion that year or thereafter. And with that would have brought popularity, TV coverage and just a whole buzz about the place. So Wimbledon one, lots of league titles in the 50s, they weren't so successful later, later down the line, and then they eventually dropped down to the National League in 85. 00:16:55:14 - 00:17:20:20 Speaker 2 They were predominantly a British League club, which is the First Division, the top, the best in the UK, but to do with financial the financial plight of the club, they moved down to the National League and they stayed there until they returned to the top flight in 91, which was very short lived as as it's been documented, they only lost till June and then unfortunately had to vacate. 00:17:20:20 - 00:17:48:23 Speaker 2 Now with Wimbledon Speedway, it did have a comeback in 2002 to 2005. But there's one common denominator throughout most of this time. When the gray bought stadium and took control of the stadium, in effect, the speedway were tenants in a stadium that's owned by a landlord. And when you're a tenant, unfortunately you have no control over your destiny. 00:17:49:00 - 00:18:14:19 Speaker 2 So Wimbledon Speedway was almost like a passenger on a roller coaster for many years, and they were riding that roller coaster very well. But as soon as that roller coaster gets stopped and you're told to get off, that's your time. And unfortunately, Wimbledon Speedway, we're told. And given that time in mid 91 because of the high rent rental on the stadium and then again in 2005. 00:18:14:20 - 00:18:26:19 Speaker 2 Yeah. So that's that's it in a nutshell. It's like riding riding a roller coaster and you're the passenger. And when you're told to get off, you've got to get off. Yeah. 00:18:26:20 - 00:18:33:08 Speaker 1 Can you describe the relationship between the different activities that happened at the stadium. 00:18:33:10 - 00:19:02:18 Speaker 2 Yes. So obviously the Wimbledon stadium was managed by the gray and the different sports. They lived hand in hand and the stock cars was introduced in the 60s. Prior to that they used the full circuit, the speedway track, which butted right up to the greyhound track. And when the stock cars was introduced, they brought the turns in on the speedway track just to shorten it so that the stock cars used slightly different bends. 00:19:02:18 - 00:19:38:14 Speaker 2 Because predominantly stock cars do turn up the shell surface, which is a crush brick dust and shell shell aggregate, so at times they work hand in hand. But there's a lot of manual work that has to be done to prepare the speedway post a stock car track meeting. Sorry. Now greyhounds, they run on a separate track, and as long as you cover that track to stop the shell getting in the sand, then in theory you could you can work hand in hand and dual tenants at a stadium and it still happens to this day across the UK. 00:19:38:16 - 00:20:02:08 Speaker 2 So they did work hand in hand. You had paddle paddle tennis as well, which was and the squash and you had the Sunday markets in the car park. So there's lots of other events that have taken place boxing in the stadium as well, lots of events. When you've got a stadium that could be multi-use, you need to give and take. 00:20:02:09 - 00:20:19:19 Speaker 2 So to be way gave and it did take like the other sports did just to make it multi-purpose. You can't have a stadium sitting there for use of once or twice a week. You need to use it multiple times and with that, each sport has to get on with each other and you have to, as I said, give and take. 00:20:19:20 - 00:20:26:24 Speaker 2 And I believe Speedway gave and it did take for its time here. Yeah. 00:20:27:01 - 00:20:35:06 Speaker 1 Can you tell us about the technical changes that happened over the years. So with the safety side, the bikes, the stadium. 00:20:35:09 - 00:21:01:16 Speaker 2 Yeah. So speedway hasn't changed much since 1928. The starting gate is the same. It came from horse racing and it's still very much the same, although it's a mechanism electrical now as opposed to mechanized and the safety of speedway, it has improved to the degree that they use air fences now foam fences. Whereas before it's chain link and still fencing. 00:21:01:18 - 00:21:40:17 Speaker 2 Now at Wimbledon we used a chain link fence, which was surprisingly pretty much butted up against the stock car fence, which was the railroad in and the, the metal cabling. And to my surprise, fortunately there was no fatalities because if you actually looked at the if you have a look at any photos of the old speedway track, you'll find that the the stock car railings were very close behind the speedway fence and and luckily Lady Luck was on our sides where no one got severely injured throughout that time. 00:21:40:19 - 00:22:14:22 Speaker 2 But with speedway it is very similar to what it was. But it has changed. The bikes have changed, they become quicker. So Wimbledon Speedway track was built in 1928. It was built for bikes to race around from 1928. The bikes these days are running a lot faster, a lot quicker and they do require slightly bigger circumference and bigger space on track to make it more more blended for for better racing, and also to give more maneuver and more room for safety lines. 00:22:14:24 - 00:22:17:00 Speaker 2 Yeah. 00:22:17:02 - 00:22:25:17 Speaker 1 And can you describe any pivotal events that happened at the stadium and also internationally? 00:22:25:19 - 00:22:45:06 Speaker 2 So obviously the war was a massive thing for, for, for London as a whole and for the stadium. It did get bombed in the war. All activities ceased from the stadium at that time. So from a financial point of view, it must have been you've got this massive facility that you can't use and it's costing a lot of money. 00:22:45:08 - 00:23:09:02 Speaker 2 I believe some forces may have used it for stationed here, but that the momentum the Speedway club gathered in in the 1930s kind of had to regather in the 40s. And if you think about had the war not happened, where would Speedway have gone had it picked up? The momentum it did in the 30s could have been even bigger in the 40s. 00:23:09:04 - 00:23:32:24 Speaker 2 And we were very successful in the 1950s, won multiple league titles. So again, Wimbledon was the glamor club, the club to be at. It's the club to race that and the club to support, as I've previously mentioned, the passing of Tommy Hanson in 76 was quite pivotal for the club on the basis that it was a shock to everyone and such a tragedy. 00:23:32:24 - 00:24:02:12 Speaker 2 And then in 85, when we dropped down to the National League, when you're dropping from a certain level, you lose sponsorship, okay, you lose the coverage. There's a lot of things that go hand in hand with racing at the top level. People want to see top flight at any sport, the most professional level possible, and a stadium the size of Wimbledon that held the, you know, the highest of Greyhound meetings, the highest of stock car meetings in 85, you're looking at second rate speedway. 00:24:02:13 - 00:24:27:16 Speaker 2 So did it feel well with the stadium owners at the time? I don't know, but my take on it would be that they would have wanted top flight speedway had it been financially possible. So the return in 91, everyone was and I was there in 91. The anticipation of where back in the top league, we're going to see the international riders, we're going to see the world champion. 00:24:27:17 - 00:24:56:02 Speaker 2 You've got Americans, Danish, South African, you know, German riders. You've got an international plethora of riders to then be told halfway through the season that we're we're closing and that's it. It's finished. That's another big, big, big pivotal moment for the Speedway. And again in 2002 with it coming back, it was pivotal for the club. Nine years later, sorry, 11 years later, you know would it. 00:24:56:04 - 00:25:27:02 Speaker 2 Would we ever believe it would come back? No. But it did it come back? Yes it did. Short lived. Yes. And then in 2005, a shock to the system and the fact, yes, we've had three lovely years at the stadium. And now, because of the rental increase, we've got a vacay again. So again, that roller coaster, as I mentioned, the point of having to get off the roller coaster and the pivotal point in the club where the end is, the end is there, and unfortunately, the supporters club nothing. 00:25:27:02 - 00:25:52:04 Speaker 2 When speedway stopped, everything stopped. So there was no continuation of the supporters club. Yes. For the year after there was, there was a possibility of trying to find another track, find another location locally. But ultimately Wimbledon Stadium plow line is where Wimbledon Speedway belonged. So it was going to be a half a hard sell to to sell to fans. 00:25:52:06 - 00:26:19:14 Speaker 2 And yeah, I would say with the club closing and the supporters club and everything sort of ceasing, it kind of it's just it's just as if, like you mothball something, put it away and you're waiting for someone to open it up again, because that's kind of what happened in 2002. In 91, it was mothballed and never spoken about again until someone took the took the guts to go to the stadium and say, hey, I want to run another sport at your stadium. 00:26:19:15 - 00:26:26:18 Speaker 2 Will you entertain it? Yes you will. Happy days. 00:26:26:20 - 00:26:31:12 Speaker 1 What do you think about the importance of speedway to the local area? 00:26:31:14 - 00:27:08:17 Speaker 2 So with any sport it brings people together, whether it be football, greyhounds, cars, speedway, any sort of team sport, tribal, you know, club colors, anything like that. It's it brings people together that might not go out. They might not particularly get involved playing a sport, but they like to support a sport. So with Wimbledon Speedway, it brought people together in the Merton and once off area and further afield on a weekly basis in the summer months. 00:27:08:19 - 00:27:29:04 Speaker 2 A lot of speedway fans supported ice hockey as well, and the two sports go hand in hand, ice hockey in the winter. And then you turn your attention to speedway in the summer. So I would say it is a community sport. So speedway is predominantly generational. So you'd go with your grandparents, your mum and dad, and then you'd bring the grandkids along. 00:27:29:04 - 00:28:15:21 Speaker 2 So you'd be introduced at an early age and then you wouldn't, you would go, as I said, as a whole family, it's a mix or mixture of female males. It's not predominantly male supported. So it's a family not out, which in this day and age I think people, you know, it's a good thing. Okay. If it was still around in Wimbledon, that to offer an opportunity for people to come together multi-generational and have an enjoyable night out with no, no arguments, no fighting, there's, you know, with the crowds, you never had any any trouble at Speedway, even with the away supporters, because you get the away supporters, come in the coach load and you speak 00:28:15:21 - 00:28:45:00 Speaker 2 to them like, hey, how are you doing? You know, I haven't seen you since last season and vice versa. You go to the away track so you'd have an outing, wouldn't you? So it's all about sporting clubs bringing people together to support the local community, but you represent the community as well. So when you wear like the football shirt or the speedway jacket, you're representing your area that you support. 00:28:45:02 - 00:28:52:15 Speaker 1 You've touched on this a bit, but is there anything else you can tell us about the demise of Speed Modern? 00:28:52:17 - 00:29:18:10 Speaker 2 Yeah. So the demise in speedway at Wimbledon is one of the major factors is the fact it was a tenant in a, in a, in a landlord owned property and it had no control over its destiny. No. No stakeholder to have any influential on where it was going to go, how long it was going to last for and how profitable it was. 00:29:18:10 - 00:29:44:00 Speaker 2 From a commercial point of view. That is the main reason. Obviously, with Speedway, generally the popularity been in a decline. If Wimbledon Speedway was here today. Yes, it may struggle, but being in the capital city with the accessibility, with the trains and busses, you've got a scope of so many different people from around the world that live in London. 00:29:44:02 - 00:29:56:19 Speaker 2 If you've got a certain percentage of them, PayPal, you know, 4000, 5000 a week, it would it would be still one of the best clubs in the country. Yeah. 00:29:56:21 - 00:30:01:20 Speaker 1 And what do you think the future holds for speedway? 00:30:01:22 - 00:30:29:18 Speaker 2 Speedway is a crossroads in the UK. It is in a tricky situation, very similar to Wimbledon, where maturity of clubs are still tenants in their own stadiums, so they still don't have any control over their destiny. They go year by year. Okay, tenancy by tenancy. And actually there is no long term aspirations for where they see the club in say 20, 30 years time. 00:30:29:19 - 00:31:03:01 Speaker 2 It's quite a green sport. It's quite a we use methanol which again it's, it's it's a clean sport. Although it's motorsport it's one of the cleanest motorsports. So from an environmental point of view and it's got a lot of safety standards within that for environmental issues. Without a big major TV contract and media back in and probably social social media back in and influential back in is going to struggle. 00:31:03:03 - 00:31:23:11 Speaker 2 The sport is as a whole, you know, is popular in other countries and it is shown that it can be promoted. Right. If it's in full control of its destiny that crowds do come. You know, in Poland you get 20,000 people for a league meeting. It's not uncommon for that to happen. Why does it happen there and not in the UK? 00:31:23:13 - 00:31:26:14 Speaker 2 Some of the reasons I've cited. 00:31:26:16 - 00:31:40:01 Speaker 1 And you've also been a rider as well. So I just want to take you through some questions around that. And well, to start off with the origin, could you tell us which years you were a writer? 00:31:40:02 - 00:32:09:22 Speaker 2 So I was fortunate to be riding in the 2000 era. So prior to Wimbledon Speedway opened in 2002, I was racing and with the announcement that the Wimbledon speedway was coming back, it was like a dream. So the moment in time when I was racing at the level I was racing, knowing that Wimbledon Speedway was coming back in the Conference League, it suited me perfectly and I knew the promoters at the time and got behind the club. 00:32:09:22 - 00:32:16:22 Speaker 2 So I managed to ride in the 2002 to 2005 era for Wimbledon Speedway. 00:32:16:24 - 00:32:20:13 Speaker 1 So how did you first get into speed and why? 00:32:20:15 - 00:32:45:05 Speaker 2 So I was introduced to speedway in the mid to late 80s. My dad come to Wimbledon Speedway in the 1960s and my granddad followed speedway as well. In fact, Barry Briggs and Ronnie Moore lived next door to my dad when my dad was growing up, and he would see them going off in the story, you know, at home was running more than Barry Briggs used to live next door, and my nan and grandad used to talk about that. 00:32:45:05 - 00:33:04:22 Speaker 2 So I was inquisitive. What is Speedway? What's it about? Dad had some old magazines and and some old badges of my mum's laying around and as a, as a 5 or 6 year old, you get inquisitive. What's this about? I'll take it. Dad says so obviously within the school holidays, because it was a late finish or couldn't go because of school. 00:33:04:24 - 00:33:22:12 Speaker 2 He introduced me and as I said, late 80s we would go to the odd meeting in the school holidays. I vividly remember a lot of rain and being very disappointed that we couldn't go and why we couldn't go, because I didn't understand when it was sunny, but it had been raining all day and the damage had been done to the track. 00:33:22:12 - 00:33:46:04 Speaker 2 So I was introduced there, and I vividly remember the last meeting in 91 because, again, being sort of just under ten years old, I was standing there watching this meeting, you know, knee high to Grasshopper and Dad saying, oh, there's Barry Briggs there. And there was lots of people, and there was a big bit of a buzz about the place, even though it was the last meeting. 00:33:46:04 - 00:34:11:09 Speaker 2 And then the rain came again and it was called off. And I remember standing at the top of the bar looking down and then going to my dad, why are they not racing anymore? And can we not come back next week? He said, no, it's finished, it's done. It's that's it. And I didn't quite understand. And I remember coming in at home and the 10:00 news and it being on the 10:00 news to say Wimbledon speedway had finished and it had ceased after so many years. 00:34:11:10 - 00:34:39:05 Speaker 2 And I still didn't really realize until I used to go to Exeter Speedway in the summer, summer months because we didn't have a track then. You know, I'm a local to Wimbledon and Mitcham and we used to go to Exeter Speedway in the summer months when we went to Devon, so I still kept in touch with Speedway and then finally got involved in racing Speedway in the late 90s, where I started at Eastbourne Speedway. 00:34:39:07 - 00:35:08:10 Speaker 2 So my dad had gone from being a fan to then the parent of a boy that was racing. So. But it was fun times because I can say that I've spent a lot of time with my dad and it's quite, quite nice to be able to spend time with your dad in a sport that you both love. Traveling to the tracks, racing, yes, having disagreements and having a lot of fun as well. 00:35:08:10 - 00:35:21:01 Speaker 2 But I'm very fortunate that I've been able to share that time with my dad. And yeah, it's very, very, very good. 00:35:21:03 - 00:35:24:07 Speaker 1 How did you end up in Wimbledon then? 00:35:24:09 - 00:35:45:20 Speaker 2 So I was racing in the 2000 era. I was racing at a club called Rye House in Hertfordshire, and knowing that Wimbledon Speedway was reopening in 2002, I had spoken to the promoter that was was coming in to run speedway and I'd already knew the year before, so I did. He did tell us that he'd gone into the stadium. 00:35:45:21 - 00:36:04:20 Speaker 2 He'd asked him if he could run speedway and he said he'd got to go ahead. So in 2001, I kind of knew something was going to happen, but I couldn't say anything. And it was a bit of a buzz because up until that point, we drive past when we stayed and I say to dad, why can't they have the speedway back there? 00:36:04:21 - 00:36:30:23 Speaker 2 Will this be way ever go? Back? Then dad would say, no, it never happened. Yeah, we'll never happen. And lo and behold, it happened. So it's kind of like a dream to then be told in advance that it's opening and then be involved in the whole media hype. You know, I was 18 at the time, you know, lots of newspaper coverage, BBC, you name it, the Evening Standard, the Daily Mirror. 00:36:31:00 - 00:36:52:10 Speaker 2 It was kind of a bit of a whirlwind, really, that I was racing Speedway, and there was a lot of other people involved and interested in what was happening to then. Race in 2002 at the opening meeting. So yeah, it was really fun. And for an 18 year old, it was a bit of a buzz. Yeah, yeah. And as I said prior to Wimbledon, I was at right House. 00:36:52:10 - 00:37:10:17 Speaker 2 So I'd done a lot of training. I'd started racing for Rye House as well. So I kind of just continued my what was my racing career from Rye House to Wimbledon and transitioned across to South London back home. 00:37:10:19 - 00:37:17:00 Speaker 1 How did you get the the skills that you were quite yet? To become a rider? 00:37:17:02 - 00:37:38:12 Speaker 2 You have to be adrenaline junkie, no fear. And you don't have to have fear because you if you if you're scared to get on a bike, then you shouldn't be racing, okay? You need to want to win as well. You're not out there to ride a bike. You're out there to race a bike. So you're out there to win a race, not just poodle around, okay? 00:37:38:13 - 00:38:00:18 Speaker 2 The moment you don't want to race, don't bother. Okay. But you want to. It's the thrill of speedway. I mean, what sport goes from north to 60 around a small circuit, 400m. Formula one cars, I think, go at that speed, 0 to 60 in two seconds, three seconds in front of thousands of people. And it's quite accessible. 00:38:00:20 - 00:38:35:16 Speaker 2 Entry level speedway. You can get yourself a bike for two, two, 3,000 pounds. You can get yourself involved in speedway quite quickly, quite easily and pick up the skills necessary to race and join a team and be paid to race. I mean, what boy would not love to be paid to race there motorbike? It's kind of the ideal for someone who's interested in motorbikes is ideal scenario, and it also gives an opportunity for people that do cause nuisance, with motorbikes, that do love motorbikes. 00:38:35:21 - 00:39:04:02 Speaker 2 And actually I've got great skill because I've seen kids racing around pulling wheelies and it takes a lot to pull a wheelie and to control it, but to hone that energy and that skill and to be paid for it. Speedway is missing a trick there because it could work with local communities to bring them people off the streets, causing nuisance to actually represent their local teams, be paid to do it, and then give the locals someone to support a team. 00:39:04:03 - 00:39:07:05 Speaker 2 Yeah. 00:39:07:07 - 00:39:13:15 Speaker 1 That will lead us quite nicely into. Could you describe your first big race of marketing? 00:39:13:17 - 00:39:42:13 Speaker 2 So my big the biggest race at women, I guess was the first opening meet in 2002. May the 2nd. It's good. It's it sticks in my mind for a lot of reasons. Not all good, because we'd had a deluge of rain the day, the day before and the morning they couldn't get the track prepared very well. So the track was very, very bad condition. 00:39:42:15 - 00:40:00:17 Speaker 2 It wasn't really racing, but we had a stream of fans, you know, I think in excess of 3000, 4000 fans come, come to see us on the opening night. For me it was like, wow, people have come to watch this race in this big stadium. I was used to a few hundred people watching us, so it was a big shock. 00:40:00:17 - 00:40:21:16 Speaker 2 And I guess that opening race not not sort of realizing that the track wasn't in racing conditions and going, wait a minute. We've got a race here in front of all these people, put on a bit of a show in light of the fact that it's worked hard to get this far. Let's not let's not fall at the first hurdle. 00:40:21:19 - 00:40:43:06 Speaker 2 The track preparation was out of my hands. I was told to race on it and it was a bit dicey. I raced in the first race with Chris Hunt. He was the captain at the time and I remember going out and not being. It wasn't like speedway as you know it. So it was a very tricky race that it was for the build up of speedway coming back. 00:40:43:07 - 00:41:04:16 Speaker 2 It wasn't expected to be like that. It was expected to be Fast furious hurling into the first bend, you know, getting in front with Chris and us getting A51 instead. It was very slow, very bumpy, very wet. And I believe I probably got second, second or third with Chris in that first race, but it was something to remember. 00:41:04:16 - 00:41:08:20 Speaker 2 But not all for a good reasons. Yeah. 00:41:08:22 - 00:41:12:05 Speaker 1 Could you tell us about your speedway heroes. 00:41:12:07 - 00:41:40:15 Speaker 2 So speedway heroes. Well, so I didn't see Barry Briggs race and I didn't see any more race, but I'd been told about Ronnie and Barry living next door to me, dad, that they were multi world champion Barry Briggs, you know, BBC sports personality, nearly nearly winner in the 60s and and Ronnie, Ronnie Moore being such a legend and they were in my eyes or speedway legends that I hadn't been fortunate enough to see race but been told so many stories about them. 00:41:40:15 - 00:42:01:09 Speaker 2 And I've been fortunate enough to meet both of them. Ronnie gave me some pointers on how to race when he came over in 2002. For me, that was quite special actually. We had an away meeting at Swindon and I struggled in one of my racist and Ronnie come over and said, I'll try this and try that. And it was a bit surreal, really. 00:42:01:10 - 00:42:36:20 Speaker 2 Like Ronnie, Ronnie Moore giving me tips on how to race speedway. You know, I never thought I'd see see that situation turning out and then obviously more modern heroes Gary Havelock winning in 92, Peter Collins in 76 and then Mark Lauren was the British world champion in 2000. So he was more recent hero. I was racing around that time and trying to sort of build a career in speedway, and Mark Lauren was a hero, a legend of that era, never gaited from the start and he was always a racer. 00:42:36:20 - 00:42:49:05 Speaker 2 So for me to to try and get anything near like he was would have been ideal, which didn't quite happen. But he was. He was definitely someone I looked up to. Yeah. 00:42:49:07 - 00:42:54:11 Speaker 1 And could you tell us a bit more about your dreams and ambitions in those early days? 00:42:54:13 - 00:43:20:16 Speaker 2 So yeah, I mean every if, if you're involved in any sport, any boy or girl teenager, you aspire to be the best in that sport. So with speedway, I aspire to race for a team. And then ideally we'd love to go on to world championship rounds. You look at the races on the telly, you watch them on the telly and you try and copy what they do on your bike. 00:43:20:18 - 00:43:42:13 Speaker 2 Either you know what they're doing or you don't, and you're doing it because. Because it looks good. You put things on your bike to match what they're doing, and you want the same colors as them. And being a teenager involved in a sport that is quite something really, you know, it's quite exciting. It's really a thrilling sport to be involved in. 00:43:42:13 - 00:44:02:06 Speaker 2 So racing for Wimbledon was was one of my dreams because it was a local team. It was the closest speedway. Why don't want to drive an hour and a half to a speedway track when I've got a track 20 minutes around the corner? That's my my well known term is it's round the corner and anyone knows that I say it's just around the corner. 00:44:02:06 - 00:44:21:22 Speaker 2 It's probably not. But anyway, it was only 20 minutes away. So yeah, that was one of my dreams, is to race for Wimbledon and then be a speedway rider and earn my money from being a speedway rider. You can earn your money at an entry level and as you progress in speedway, you can you make a living out of it. 00:44:21:23 - 00:44:45:11 Speaker 2 So that was my my dream while I was at school, doodling on on the back of a pencil case when I should have been probably spending more time on what I was learning in class. Instead, I was thinking about what I'm going to do at the weekend, what I'm where I'm racing. I vividly remember at school or college, sorry, racing on a Monday night. 00:44:45:12 - 00:45:04:06 Speaker 2 So we'd come home from from college and have to get the bike packed ready to go, and dad would come straight from work and we'd shoot over to Rye House, which is in Hertfordshire. And if the weather was, if a, I would always be waiting with my mobile to see if it's been called off because the team manager would call me or send me a text to say meeting off. 00:45:04:06 - 00:45:28:07 Speaker 2 And Monday morning, if the weather was iffy, I'd be sort of checking my phone in my bag at school going is it on? Is it off? Is it on? So yeah, things like that, you know. But you do that when you love a sport, whether that be football, speedway or rugby and you dedicate a lot of time to it and you kind of, yeah, cut you in half and and you are that. 00:45:28:09 - 00:45:38:11 Speaker 1 So thinking about your racing life, could you give us a little bit more of a fuller overview of your career, like from white House? 00:45:38:16 - 00:46:09:20 Speaker 2 Yeah. So I started at spawn in 1997. I contact there was a BBC program called activate, which was about trying different sports, introducing sports to people on CBC. And I'd contacted the British Speedway Promoters Association to find out where the local track was, because we'd lost touch with Speedway a little bit at that point in 97 and then realized Eastbourne was, you know, Eastbourne races on a Saturday night. 00:46:09:21 - 00:46:31:01 Speaker 2 Let's go down there. Oh, there's a training track. Let's have a go before you know it. That Christmas I'd got a bike for Christmas. So there we go. That's the start of the journey is I got the speedway bike for Christmas. I mean wow, what? I would not want to have a motorbike for Christmas when they're sort of 15, 16. 00:46:31:03 - 00:46:50:09 Speaker 2 And then from there we would go down to Eastbourne and train on the mini track and spend Saturday afternoons there prior to the to the actual race meeting, and then it progressed from there. We would go to training tracks down at Kent and I Wade and then eventually Rye House, which, which was running, and they run a conference league level. 00:46:50:09 - 00:47:17:14 Speaker 2 So an entry level. So that's where I went to. So I started at Eastbourne, which was very much arch rivals of Wimbledon, but for training purposes that was the only track entry level to hire a bike, then buy a bike, then start racing and practicing. I weighed. So basically on a Sunday it would be like Sunday, Sunday league level, getting practice at the track on a Sunday and then racing at Rye House on a Monday to get extra time in as well. 00:47:17:14 - 00:47:40:02 Speaker 2 I used to what you would call second off races, which is a junior races after a meeting. So as if you've got a main match going on and then after the match is finished, they'd have the juniors out. So have a little practice, maybe a bit of sparring with with the away riders as well. So I'd race at Arena Essex, which is Lakeside near Lakeside Shopping Center. 00:47:40:05 - 00:48:02:01 Speaker 2 I'd try and get, you know, get a reading on a Monday night as well. So again, try and get races where you can when you're starting out. And then once you get to a certain level, you get invited to the races and it's all about track time and practice and race, race time, race practice as well. So yeah. 00:48:02:03 - 00:48:09:17 Speaker 1 Could you describe the equipment and the gear that you had back then? 00:48:09:19 - 00:48:39:14 Speaker 2 So when I started in Speedway, we hired a bike from Norris at Eastbourne, and then eventually mum and dad bought a bike from McMorris for Christmas. So it's a little Honda. Honda CG 125A lovely little bike. Wish I'd never sold it. Now it's decked out in its powder coated blue, baby blue and white at the time. But I always used a Wimbledon racetrack actually, because I had one specially made out with the name on the back. 00:48:39:14 - 00:49:11:04 Speaker 2 So wherever I rode, I rode with the Wimbledon star even at that early age. So yeah. And then from there I sort of progressed from one, two, 5 to 500. At that time, there was no real in between level, and now there's a 250 cc intermediate level, but went straight from one, one, two, 5 to 500. Obviously, you know, family, mum and dad were a bit concerned, you know, sort of 16 year old getting on a 500 cc without breaks. 00:49:11:09 - 00:49:43:02 Speaker 2 Got to remember that. No brakes on these bikes guys. So yeah. So I you know we invested in a new helmet and more safety a safety gear. So it protected me from getting injured. And then we used the 560 there on. And that's the highest level that you the biggest bite you can race in speedway. But as the years went on improved my equipment, bought new equipment so that I could compete with with the other lads at that level. 00:49:43:04 - 00:49:47:03 Speaker 1 Were there any notable changes over time? 00:49:47:05 - 00:50:18:00 Speaker 2 When I was racing the the style of bike changed considerably. So there was what we call an upright bike, which is the engine is bolted vertically in the in the frame, which creates different drive aspects for the back wheel. And in the mid 90s, late 90s they moved it to a horizontal position. So the the way the bike acted on on track was different. 00:50:18:01 - 00:50:44:12 Speaker 2 It drive more and the G-forces working on you as a rider a slightly different from a physics point of view. The center of gravity is different. And they also introduced leading link forks, which gave you slight suspension on the front wheel, whereas before they were telescopic. So when I upgraded my equipment, I upgraded to that same, you know, horizontal or they call it lay down engine. 00:50:44:12 - 00:51:10:14 Speaker 2 And we've laid in link forks as well. So the idea was to improve, increase the speed of speedway and improve the ride for a rider as well. And they introduced dirt deflectors as well to stop the dirt flying up from the back wheel, hitting the other riders behind and the fans as well. Yeah. 00:51:10:16 - 00:51:17:13 Speaker 1 Could you tell us about the dangers of the sport and even if there were any injuries that you yourself. 00:51:17:18 - 00:51:34:06 Speaker 2 So yeah, I mean you're racing a bike or if you're riding a bike, you know, there's always a possibility you come off the bike and you have a broken arm or leg or worse. Now I'll speak by is unique in the fact that. 00:51:34:08 - 00:51:52:00 Speaker 2 It's safe and it's not safe. Okay. So you've got like minded people on bikes racing with you so, you know, you can sort of trust them and you're safe with them. Whereas on a road you don't know who's going to pull out in front of you who that car driver is. Are you more likely to get killed on the road than speedway? 00:51:52:00 - 00:52:22:16 Speaker 2 I would say yes, because as I said, speedway, the riders know each other, you respect each other and you give people room. There is unfortunately, the times when when things go wrong in 76, when Tommy got killed and unfortunately the day before Wimbledon opened in 2002, I vividly remember a rider at King's Lynn, David Nicks, got killed. So again, the whole hype of Wimbledon opening, knowing that the day before someone had got killed at King's Lynn and he was a rider that was only a couple years older than me. 00:52:22:16 - 00:52:42:01 Speaker 2 So it kind of brought home the fact, the reality of the dangers of speedway when you're racing and when you're at the meeting, you have to park that away. You know, it's a conversation you have after and at home that just just being mindful of that. But you can't be thinking of that when you're racing because it would be unsafe. 00:52:42:03 - 00:53:07:13 Speaker 2 Me personally, I broke my metatarsal, so I was very fortunate. I actually did gymnastics for years. I was a gymnast, so I learned how to fall quite easily and rotate, come off the bike. I've come off the bike loads of times. If you're not going quick enough and you're not trying, you know that's what happens. You come off at times and I know how to come off with speedway. 00:53:07:15 - 00:53:33:07 Speaker 2 There's you should as part of the train and know how to come off the bike. It's quite common practice to slide off the bike or over slide, because speedway bikes slide around the corners on the shell surface. If you're going to get very close to that rider in front of you, because you respect that rider and you don't want to enjoy yourself and injure him or damage your bike, and what you do is you do an over slide so you drop the bike to its left side, okay? 00:53:33:08 - 00:53:57:07 Speaker 2 The back will come slightly off the ground and you lose traction. Basically you over slide the bike. You don't hurt yourself. You scuff, scuff one side of your bike on one side of your lover's, but ultimately you've saved yourself from maybe high side and smashed into the other rider and damaging by for you and your bikes. So, you know, riders coming off of speedway bikes is common. 00:53:57:07 - 00:54:19:13 Speaker 2 It's common practice and we're prepared for it every time when we're racing. So and no one should be afraid to come off the bike, but it's about coming off the bike the correct way, the most cleanest and safest way possible, as opposed to clattering and doing a high side. Then no doubt you're going to have an injury. So I was very fortunate to have the skill set to be able to come off the bike as safely. 00:54:19:16 - 00:54:48:13 Speaker 2 If you could say that safely as possible to alleviate any major injuries. And don't get me wrong, there's been major injuries in speedway fatalities and and unfortunately, circumstances that left people in wheelchairs. So you're fully aware of that. And as long as you give yourself adequate room and adequate skill set and the protection as well, wearing the right equipment, then you know, you're taking them risks on board and you'll accept them risks. 00:54:48:15 - 00:54:56:11 Speaker 2 But the adrenaline and the thrill of riding kind of outweighs them. So. 00:54:56:13 - 00:55:04:20 Speaker 1 How did the economics work? So in terms of having other jobs or maybe acquiring sponsorships. 00:55:04:22 - 00:55:30:07 Speaker 2 Yeah. So when when I was racing at Rye House, we were very fortunate that the supporters club and the promoter, Len Silver, thoroughly back to all and supported us financially. So I was very fortunate to be involved in that and thank them for their support. When we come to Wimbledon again, I improved my equipment and at that point I was at college and also working as well. 00:55:30:07 - 00:55:52:00 Speaker 2 So I was actually at college working and trying to raise speed by. So I was a swimming teacher and lifeguard at Wimbledon, so nice and local, you know, and the stadium was just up the road. So perfect, perfect scenario. So I could earn some money. I was going to college and I was I was doing sports coaching management. 00:55:52:01 - 00:56:17:20 Speaker 2 At the same time I would speak about my speedway. They would know about speedway as well. And yeah, it was a fine balancing act. Also, my dad full time work and being my mechanic and my driver and basically person to I wouldn't be at speedway without my dad, you know, we went hand in hand. I didn't go to speedway meetings without my dad helping me. 00:56:17:22 - 00:56:24:02 Speaker 2 It kind of went we went together and it was our thing that we did together. Yeah. 00:56:24:04 - 00:56:28:22 Speaker 1 Could you describe your relationship with other team members or managers? 00:56:28:24 - 00:56:48:17 Speaker 2 Yeah. So I mean, as I said, I had a great relationship with the management there, Len Silver and the sports club, they thoroughly supported us and the riders. An entry level, you're good friends with the riders, but you also sort of rivals a little bit. You're trying to get that team spot so, you know, you have a laugh and a joke. 00:56:48:17 - 00:57:11:06 Speaker 2 But when it comes to putting the helmet on, you really want to beat them. Really. So, you know, all friendship goes out the window, but does respect does does remain. When we come to Wimbledon again, I picked up a few local sponsors. You've got the opportunity to offer local companies opportunity to advertise their name on your bike. So I was fortunate to to have some local back in there as well. 00:57:11:06 - 00:57:18:12 Speaker 2 So which was nice. It helped financially as well to to upgrade my equipment. Ready to race for Wimbledon. Yeah. 00:57:18:14 - 00:57:20:20 Speaker 1 Did you have the manager? 00:57:20:22 - 00:57:45:16 Speaker 2 The manager? I didn't personally have a manager. Speedway riders. Unless you're at a very top level, you don't have your own personal manager, not your dad or your mechanic. But we did have a team manager at Wimbledon and Andy Day at the time, at Wimbledon in 2002, and got on very well with him as well. And previously to that John Stamford at Rye House gone very well with him as well. 00:57:45:21 - 00:58:05:03 Speaker 2 Team managers in speedway liaise with the riders, makes them, they get there on time, give them the instructions and the locations where they need to be and give them the kick up the ass when they need to. They a team manager and speedway also tells you when you need to race. They give you the program and say you're out in this race, that race, that race in that helmet color. 00:58:05:03 - 00:58:15:16 Speaker 2 So they kind of help you out and guide you through the meeting as well. So I had a good relationship with John and the manager at Wimbledon. 00:58:15:18 - 00:58:32:03 Speaker 1 Could you tell us you didn't touch on it because you talked about the other team members and and having that respect, but maybe give us a little bit more information about the rivalries and the competition side. 00:58:32:06 - 00:59:10:16 Speaker 2 Yes. So with the conference league level, which was what Wimbledon was racing at its entry level. So you've got a lot of British riders, that one making name for themselves. And I vividly remember 2003 for maybe we used to have Volta races, I think they called it. So prior to the meeting starting they would put me up against, I think there's two others to other races at the time that I knew personally as well, and the the whole point of doing that was to see who won that race and who was best, and they would be put in the team for that meeting in half hour's time. 00:59:10:16 - 00:59:31:18 Speaker 2 So you had to get there before the meeting started. You had to race. Normally it was one race to prove that you're good enough for the team, and then you were put forward for that, for the team that evening, in half an hour's time, be presented to the fans and you'd racing that meeting, and if you didn't make the cut, then you'd be in the second half after the meeting now. 00:59:31:23 - 01:00:03:07 Speaker 2 Yeah. Not always did I make the cup and I lost my place to the other two riders or one of them either riders. So yeah, it's hard knowing that it's a cutthroat business. Speedway. They need the best riders in the team because you've got you've got a race against and you've got to win against the opposition. So but knowing that you want your team to race, if you're not riding well on that day, you need to accept it and you need to accept the fact that someone's going to take your spot and you're please, for the fact that the team goes on and wins because your day will come. 01:00:03:09 - 01:00:31:05 Speaker 2 You're having a bad day in any sport. You can have off days, okay? It's like a squad system. You want to pick your best racers, okay. And sometimes you need to accept you're not the best one for that day. And yeah, a good sportsman knows that and knows that. Yeah, you need to stand aside for someone else. But equally, at the same time, another day will come when you're in the team and someone else would have to stand up outside. 01:00:31:07 - 01:00:34:22 Speaker 1 Could you tell us about any characters of the sport? 01:00:34:24 - 01:01:08:05 Speaker 2 Yeah. So I mean, there's various characters in the sport now and previously, you know, some would say that the characters are more so, you know, historically where riders would spend more time with the fans and do silly antics and things like that, where speedway can sometimes be seen as it's an entertainment, but it's also a sport. So it's, you know, there'll be occasions where riders have a few fisticuffs and they'd always say, get it out on the track, let the fans see the fight. 01:01:08:06 - 01:01:37:00 Speaker 2 People want to see a fight at ice hockey. Everyone loves the fight. But where the sport of speedway has become more sporty and regulated with sport and regulation becomes rules. And if rules are broken, then there's repercussions and penalties for that. So it does prevent the gray areas of a bit of banter, you know, a bit of a bit of banter with the riders and or maybe a fisticuffs. 01:01:37:00 - 01:02:03:02 Speaker 2 It's not really not really anything untoward, but it's just part of an entertainment. And speedway is an entertainment sport. So there's a balance there. And some of the characters in the past, you know, Barry Briggs, you know, he's a character, he's refined racer and astute businessman, and he led well with the media as well. So he he really pushed speedway in the media. 01:02:03:02 - 01:02:29:12 Speaker 2 So he's a great character. There's there's all other other characters in Speedway. You know the race for Wimbledon as well as I mentioned, Tommy Hansen real, you know, dashing Swedish rider the fans loved and would have his poster pinned up on their bedroom wall, I'm sure. And then you've got the other characters, you know, the ones that maybe, you know, cut corners and rub people out the wrong way. 01:02:29:13 - 01:02:35:01 Speaker 2 So, you know, but that comes with every sport. Yeah. 01:02:35:03 - 01:02:39:19 Speaker 1 Could you tell us anything about the skullduggery that was that happened? 01:02:39:21 - 01:03:05:18 Speaker 2 Yeah. I mean, there's there's certain things that go on in speedway or have gone on in speedway historically. I wasn't involved in any shenanigans of that sort. But I've heard stories. I mean, there's stories from even the, well, the first world championship, you know, it's well documented. You know, about a check check being passed through hands on who was going to be the winner. 01:03:05:21 - 01:03:38:09 Speaker 2 And more recently, you know, it's been documented about fixing races and stuff like that, which, you know, in the 70s. So yeah, there's all sorts going on. It's there's other oddity things that go on as well. And what I call banter, you know, people putting sugar in the final which makes the bikes not run and things like that and other things that go on outside of the race meeting, you know, mechanics driving, you know, when you're driving long distances, you've got to fill your time with a lot of antics, you know. 01:03:38:11 - 01:04:04:07 Speaker 2 Yeah. Changing driver while you're driving through the on the motorway and work that one out. How'd you get your passenger in the driver's seat and the driver back in the passenger seat? That's a conundrum. So yeah, there's lots of lots of antics like that that go on. But skullduggery. Yeah, there's always going to be when you've got rivalry, you've got people that want to outdo people, you know, race fixing and maybe a bit of cheating. 01:04:04:07 - 01:04:27:07 Speaker 2 Now and again you're going to get caught. There's we've, we've sport and rules and regulations. They get checked. So you know oversize in your engines and maybe honing out your, your carburetors and putting nitro in your carburetor. You can do it, but you'll get caught. And if you're in a race, you know, you've done it by cheating. So does it make you feel any better off? 01:04:27:09 - 01:04:32:19 Speaker 2 I didn't do it. So the question is asked to those people that have. 01:04:32:21 - 01:04:36:17 Speaker 1 How did Speedway impact your family life? 01:04:36:19 - 01:05:02:07 Speaker 2 So speedway, as I said, it's a sport that my mum and dad, my grandparents, were about and followed. My mum and dad used to go to White City when they first met and dad, as I said, when he was younger. So it wasn't a new sport to us as a family. Obviously when I started racing and before that my dad, it was a sport that my dad bought me to. 01:05:02:08 - 01:05:29:06 Speaker 2 My sisters weren't necessarily interested at the time. Now getting involved in racing, there's a cost element to that. So I no doubt financial impacts on the family, the fact that I was racing, although I tried to finance it as much as I could and yeah, I guess it's time away from the family a little bit, you know, taking me to races, you know, would would take time away from everyone else. 01:05:29:07 - 01:05:49:22 Speaker 2 You know, I've got two sisters as well. And. Yeah, it's time away. You know, if you can do it as a family, it's a bonus. If you're all love speedway or any sport, you can do it as a, as a as a weekend away or day out. But it can be hard on families from a financial and a time point of view. 01:05:49:23 - 01:05:54:10 Speaker 2 Yeah. 01:05:54:12 - 01:06:12:18 Speaker 1 Just thinking very specifically about the race itself now. Yeah. Give us a really poor picture of what the race day at number one would be like, thinking about any preparation that you have to do and the rituals that you had, what the crowd was like. 01:06:12:19 - 01:06:13:17 Speaker 2 Yeah, paint. 01:06:13:17 - 01:06:14:20 Speaker 1 That's a beautiful picture. 01:06:14:21 - 01:06:35:08 Speaker 2 Okay. Right. So yeah, I think we raced on a Thursday. Yeah. Thursday night when I was racing for Wimbledon. So 730 start. So I'd even be working in the day normally finish on an early shift and then I have to get back load the bike up. Bike was normally prepared the night before. So washed. Ready race ready, set up. 01:06:35:09 - 01:06:55:23 Speaker 2 Already knew what the set was going to be because it's my home track, so it would be a case of getting to the track about 5 or 6 ish. We were never keen to get to the track too early. My dad was always keen to get us there, just just on time. Too much time hanging around, talking can put you off kind of mind games. 01:06:55:24 - 01:07:21:10 Speaker 2 And dad always said that I raced better when we got there just before. Sometimes it was just before, so yeah, we get to to Wimbledon. You'd always be presented with the big stadium, big queue outside, particularly on that opening night, the long queue winding itself around into Plow Lane. And you thought, oh, there's a lot of people come here to watch us. 01:07:21:12 - 01:07:48:07 Speaker 2 You'd always be wondering what the tracks can be like. Has it been raining? Has it not been raining. Because that affects the bike setup. And then you'd pull into the car park normally, be someone on the gate there that, you know, tiny who's not tiny or someone, and you have a good little chat with them. Then you pulled all along, park up and then unload your bikes and and wheel them in under the tunnel, which is quite well known. 01:07:48:09 - 01:08:14:18 Speaker 2 It was the kind of the entrance to the the the amp theater. As you approached the slope and the two gates, you'd have someone on the gate there signing you in. That changed. Kim. Kim used to do it. Kim Thompson and others did it as well and sign you in. And your mechanic in which was dad. And then we'd put the bikes that set the bikes up and then have a look at the track. 01:08:14:19 - 01:08:32:07 Speaker 2 That's you want to look at the track, see what state the track is in, and then you can gauge how you're going to set the bike up and how you're going to approach it. And then, yeah, you'd be there a couple hours before maybe an hour and a half before, and then slowly the stadium would start filling with people. 01:08:32:09 - 01:08:52:14 Speaker 2 There's more official people come in checking licenses, checking your bike scrutineering, you know, and then half hour before the start, there's the warm up where you warm your engines up. You never run an engine cold, so you'd run it, test it, check. It's working all right. Meanwhile, the tractors doing this stuff on the track, watering the track, preparing it. 01:08:52:20 - 01:09:10:02 Speaker 2 You know, the PA guys on the on the system is all a bit of a buzz building as the more fans coming in at Wimbledon, you would walk down the tunnel across where the entrance was and you'd go to the changing room and normally the fans would sort of grab you and say, can I have your autograph? You know, how are you doing? 01:09:10:03 - 01:09:28:16 Speaker 2 You know, oh, you're racing tonight, you know, and there'd be new fans, old fans, people decked in the Wimbledon colors or someone who's just come along first day, you know, so you get changed and then when you come back, you'd be stopped again by fans and it would be great. You know, people were asking for your autograph, having photos taken. 01:09:28:17 - 01:09:54:09 Speaker 2 And this is prior to to, you know, iPhones. And then, you know, that's when you have to get a bit serious. You walk past that and then that's your serious face on there or resting bitch face, as I was always said to have. And then, yeah, you're out on your parade, presented to the fans and then it's race one. 01:09:54:10 - 01:10:15:03 Speaker 2 I was normally never in race one, I was positioned in number 6 or 7 and positioned at four sometimes. So normally heat two I'd be going out. So I'd already seen the first race. See what the tracks like, see how the riders have gone, hoping they've got A51. And then then it was head down and off we go, and then through the meeting. 01:10:15:03 - 01:10:42:23 Speaker 2 But as the preparation to the meeting built, so did the buzz and the anticipation. A little bit of nerves, but the nerves don't ever get the better of you. It's kind of adrenaline. Nerves. And once, once, once. Just when your name is being announced on the turnover, it kind of gives you a real buzz and it really motivates you to go, yeah, you know, they come to see us race and I've heard my name over the tannoy this this. 01:10:42:24 - 01:10:46:10 Speaker 2 Let's get going. You know let's do it. Let's do this. You know. 01:10:46:11 - 01:10:52:05 Speaker 1 Did you have any, any rituals for yourself that you might have done at home to prepare? 01:10:52:06 - 01:11:14:01 Speaker 2 Yeah. So I didn't personally have any, any, any, any things I did out of routine. I was always doing sports coaching manager. I was always told that if you if you have a routine and you can't do that routine, then you're in a bit of trouble and then your mindset goes. So it's always from a sportspersons point of view, it's better sometimes not to have to be bound to that ritual because you then require it. 01:11:14:01 - 01:11:26:06 Speaker 2 And if you don't do it, you start panicking. So I never had any particular routine other than get there just before the start. And that was led by dad. 01:11:26:07 - 01:11:29:15 Speaker 1 Could you tell us a bit more about the thrill of a race? 01:11:29:17 - 01:11:47:05 Speaker 2 Yeah, I mean, you're, you know, you're going up to the tapes, you know, all four of you, you're doing a clutch start, practice start, you know, just checking their things, working start marshals bringing the riders up to the line. You've got, you know, the tracks has finished grading the track. If it's under lights, you know the lights. The lights are on. 01:11:47:06 - 01:12:08:06 Speaker 2 The fans are, you know, whistling and honking the horns and stuff and shouting. And the announcer is announcing the riders, you know, occasionally you might be able to hear your name, but probably not because you rev in the engines up and then, you know, the stock marshal brings you up to the tapes at Wimbledon, particularly the big grandstand was to the right of you. 01:12:08:06 - 01:12:30:23 Speaker 2 So in your professional vision, a big glass stand and some would always be coming down across, across the tapes there because it's set on the other side. And the marshal would bring you up to the tapes and then it's then the referee's in charge. So the referee presses the green button and he presses the button to release the tapes. 01:12:30:23 - 01:12:52:17 Speaker 2 And once the tapes start, you know, it's go. It's just it's nonstop. So there's a bit of gamesmanship sometimes not wanting to come up to the start first, because if you're at the start you're waiting for the other riders. Do you want to be the last one up? Are you reading your bike the loudest? Are you being really quiet in what you're doing? 01:12:52:19 - 01:13:12:07 Speaker 2 Are you focusing on on? You know you've got a vision, vision, eyes you winning the race. That's how race is a one. You've got to visualize. You win in it and get into the first bend first. If you don't visualize that, then you will not get to the first bend first and you will not win that race. And it is about getting to that first bend. 01:13:12:07 - 01:13:31:23 Speaker 2 So you've got control of the race. So the tapes go up, you're revving the engine and you drop the clutch when them tapes go and it's hurting into that first bend. You all want to be in that same spot, that sweet spot in the first bend closest to the white line at Wimbledon, because that's the shortest way round and everyone wants to get to that spot. 01:13:31:23 - 01:14:04:02 Speaker 2 So that's four riders, 1 in 1 position. So sometimes that doesn't always work out. And someone ends up on the deck and scuffs their bike up. And then you've got four races. If you haven't made that sweet spot to get past that rider, sometimes that can be difficult if the track's dry and it's not prepared as a racer would want it, but it's all it's all the same for all of them riders, so you've got to make the best of what's what's given to you and you've got four, four laps to do that. 01:14:04:04 - 01:14:23:04 Speaker 2 As the laps go on, your conscious that you've got less and less time to make up if you are not in first position. But if you are in first position, you're conscious that you've got three other riders behind you that want your position and want to come past you. So you're almost head down and looking to win the race. 01:14:23:04 - 01:14:39:22 Speaker 2 But you're also conscious that you could have a rider come into the left and the right of you. So there's a bit of tactics, there's a bit of blocking covering the corners so they can't come past you. Some people would say that if you're second, you're in a better position because you can anticipate when to come past that rider in front of you. 01:14:39:23 - 01:14:58:05 Speaker 2 You don't have wing mirrors on the bike, so it is a case of listening to the rider next to your behind you and seeing in your peripheral vision if someone is going to overtake. Because if you're second and you're lining up the sweet spot to come past can stay, pass that rider in front and before you know it, that right in front is gone. 01:14:58:07 - 01:15:18:21 Speaker 2 He's looked left and right and he's gone past and they've already gained four meters on them. And then you've got another lap or two laps to gain that back. So yeah, there's different tactics in speedway and it's all to do with abilities. If you can get out at the start and get to that first first, bend first and control the race. 01:15:18:23 - 01:15:28:09 Speaker 1 Okay, so just thinking about Wimbledon stating they sell, would you say that made this stadium so special? 01:15:28:11 - 01:15:51:19 Speaker 2 I think the fact that it was one of the first stadiums in the country to host Speedway, it was a glamor club. It was a club that everyone aspired to race for. It had the best facilities in concerning speedway in the UK, and it had a buzz about it because it was a, you know, oval, complete stadium, all undercover. 01:15:51:21 - 01:16:28:01 Speaker 2 It gave that the noise. The speedway bikes rated against the glass stand. And that's the only place that I'd say speedway sounds so gladiatorial at Wimbledon. You know, you could say that about the old Wembley and the old White City, because again, there are, you know, Olympic Stadium and big stadiums that were complete, as in all covered. And the sound, sounds, sounds and lights make, make things sometimes with any with theatrical work and musical work, if you've got the right set in the right light and the right sound, then some. 01:16:28:01 - 01:16:54:21 Speaker 2 It sounds amazing. You do the same thing without the sound and the light and it sounds awful. Speedway under lights at Wimbledon was great, you know, lit stadium focused, focused on the racetrack. The sound verb writing round. It just gave all the attributes for a great entertainment and a great night out. Yeah. 01:16:54:23 - 01:16:57:18 Speaker 1 Could you tell us a bit more about the fans? 01:16:57:20 - 01:17:29:24 Speaker 2 Yeah. So Wimbledon fans, I mean, yeah, they really were really diehard dedicated fans. I mean, when, when I was, when I was small and first came here in the late 80s, you know, you would hear him chanting, shouting, you know, for the riders. And then when it reintroduced in 2002, vividly remember, you know, the, the sort of shouting and hollering from the fans and the, the red, red and red and yellow flags and clothing. 01:17:30:01 - 01:17:52:00 Speaker 2 We had the Pit Bend Loonies at Wimbledon, which were renowned for standing on the pit bend back in the late 80s. I do remember them, as I said, I was very small and I remember them being very loud, very noisy and the last meeting had a big banner up. You know, we don't want to be beside the seaside because the club was being relocated to Eastbourne Speedway temporarily. 01:17:52:02 - 01:18:18:17 Speaker 2 So yeah, homemade banners and lots of cheering and shouting in. When it came back in 2002, we weren't allowed to use the pit bend due to health and safety reasons. So you had them all on the home straight. So Wimbledon was unique in the fact that I had the Pit Bend loonies and also in in the 80s when Dave Lennon promoted speedway, they had the Backstreet Boys and the Home Straight gang. 01:18:18:19 - 01:18:46:09 Speaker 2 They dubbed them all different names for different parts of the stadium where you stood to watch. So Wimbledon fans were always friendly, all right. They always come up to you, always spoke to in the bar after, before the meeting, before you got changed and asked how you doing? There was so friendly Wimbledon fans. They were the best fans in Speedway. 01:18:46:11 - 01:18:50:01 Speaker 1 What is it like being a part of the women's and the community? 01:18:50:03 - 01:19:23:08 Speaker 2 So yeah, I mean representing I mean we wouldn't be where represented the borough of Wimbledon. You know, when you, you put that race jacket on, you know, with the yellow star, you're representing Wimbledon across a nationwide British, British League. Whichever league you're in, you're representing your town across your across the country. And something special, particularly as I grew up in the area, grew up Norbury, Mitcham and Wimbledon, you know, did a lot of activities in Wimbledon, worked in Wimbledon. 01:19:23:10 - 01:19:46:08 Speaker 2 So to then represent your your town local area in a nationwide competition is something special. You know, the mayor of Merton was here on the opening night in 2002, you know, and I thought, wow, this is this is something, you know, you know, with the with a gold chain and stuff like that. So it was good that it was recognized by them as well. 01:19:46:08 - 01:19:58:13 Speaker 2 And historically, it has been recognized. You know, there's been some famous well known people at Wimbledon Speedway, you know, that have have joined Wimbledon Speedway for, for a night's entertainment. So, yeah. 01:19:58:15 - 01:20:05:10 Speaker 1 Could you tell us about your best day at Wimbledon? 01:20:05:12 - 01:20:12:12 Speaker 2 I think. 01:20:12:14 - 01:20:19:00 Speaker 2 Probably the best day at Wimbledon, racing for Wimbledon. 01:20:19:02 - 01:20:42:07 Speaker 2 I don't remember I can't remember all my stats here, but, I mean, the opening meeting was good. I think I got I think I got six points, which is for, for entry level was quite good in the conditions it was. And about that I think probably 4 or 5 points per meeting thereafter. So I was always lower down the team order compared to the number ones or number 2 or 3. 01:20:42:09 - 01:21:12:09 Speaker 2 So I would say probably the opening meeting was one of my best points scoring of of my speedway career at Wimbledon. I've had other, other good meetings, individual meetings. I paired up with Wimbledon rider Gareth Hickman. We've won a pairs meeting down at I Wade and various individual meetings that I've done well in on one trophies in. Sometimes individual meetings are nice because you've done it yourself at the same time. 01:21:12:11 - 01:21:35:01 Speaker 2 Equally so is team racing and representing the team. You know, in the latter part of 2002, when there was a meeting, I don't recall who it was against them. You know, we won and you get paraded around in front of the fans and it's quite that's quite nice, isn't it, to know that you were part of a team that raced that night and you won the meet in and you know, the fans? 01:21:35:03 - 01:21:59:15 Speaker 2 2002 was a difficult year for Wimbledon Speedway because yes, it opened up. We'd had a lot of change in riders. Riders, if you look at a squad system, I think we'd got for about 20 riders that season. So it was a big turnaround in riders that year. So the winds were few and far between. So when they were there, when we did win matches, they were really sweet. 01:21:59:17 - 01:22:11:10 Speaker 2 Yeah, it was a difficult year, 2002 and it only got better 2003 four and five, obviously 2005 when nearly won the league and come second to Oxford. 01:22:11:12 - 01:22:18:15 Speaker 1 And then what would you say was a worse then. 01:22:18:17 - 01:22:39:10 Speaker 2 Do you know what the first mate is really strange to say this. The first and the first meeting at Wimbledon, I've just said is my best, but it's also my worst because it's the meeting that my dad wasn't at. My dad had got food poisoning from the stadium. He got e-coli at a running for dinner, which was one week before the opening meeting. 01:22:39:12 - 01:23:02:06 Speaker 2 He was hospitalized in Saint George's Hospital and he was the one person I wanted there. At the opening meeting. He was always at my matings. He was my mechanic and he was the person I spoke to at the meetings. So it was bittersweet that first meeting because he was not there. He wanted to be there, but he was very, very ill in Saint George's Hospital. 01:23:02:06 - 01:23:20:16 Speaker 2 And it was a bit sad that because it was we'd spoken about it for so long and he missed the opening meeting and I missed him as well, because I needed him there. But it's what happens. But yeah, that was, I would say, actually bittersweet. It's my worst and my best meeting. 01:23:20:18 - 01:23:27:24 Speaker 1 We're just moving on to the final question. How did the lower of Wimbledon Stadium affect you? 01:23:28:01 - 01:23:49:13 Speaker 2 So obviously it wasn't the first time it had closed. You know, I'd been through that in 91, you know, as a as a sort of just under ten year old. So I was prepared for the fact that, oh, if this is the end and it's the end, but there was a bit of optimism because at the end of 2005, there's always the rumors. 01:23:49:14 - 01:24:09:08 Speaker 2 Oh, it's closing, its closing. It's about rent, you know, and you don't know the actual factual truth. And, you know, it doesn't need to be put out in the main media until it's concrete. And there was always the hope that the, you know, conditions could be changed and terms could be changed. So it could continue. They were still in the Conference League. 01:24:09:09 - 01:24:29:06 Speaker 2 The idea was to move up. If you move up in the leagues, then you get Sky coverage. You'd get Wimbledon back on TV, mainstream TV channels, which was what we wanted. I was always conference league level, so I knew that if they moved up, you know, there was no chance of me racing for Wimbledon, but for the for the sake of the club, I wanted to see the club move up. 01:24:29:11 - 01:24:51:23 Speaker 2 I wanted them to move up the year before that to show progression, showing progression. You'd get commercial back in, like I said, the TV coverage. So that last meeting I was sitting on the pit bend with Steve Ribbons, who had opened it in 2002, and I sat there and I said, Steve, is this really closing? He said, I hope not. 01:24:51:24 - 01:25:16:14 Speaker 2 I just hope not. And I said, you know, I hope not as well. Do you remember we sat here in 2002 and we said, oh, it's open, you've got it open. Although the conditions weren't great, it's open. So it was a bit of a pinch yourself moment going, are we going through this again? Are we actually we'd seen the season out 2005 as opposed to 91 where it was mid-season, but were we actually not going to come back. 01:25:16:14 - 01:25:37:20 Speaker 2 And there was a long wait because that was in October 2005. So the new season didn't start to March 2006. So between there's six months where something could happen, there could be a commercial deal, there could be a reprieve where a deal is done so that it can continue. And it never happened. It was hoping it would happen. 01:25:37:20 - 01:25:58:23 Speaker 2 There was talk of finding a track close by, you know, but ultimately we needed to be in this stadium, in Wimbledon Stadium and it never happened. And you almost had hope. You had hope before that it would come back. And leading up to 2006 season, there was hope that something would change. Something would happen to be the catalyst to make them be able to come back. 01:25:58:24 - 01:26:19:20 Speaker 2 And even after that, in 2007, there was we had there was a few odd meetings at Plymouth, at Weymouth, which I was involved in. The supporters club carried on either, though we'd vacated when Wooden Stadium and they had they put these meetings on and then there was always the idea is could we come back in 2000 and 708, the increased rent? 01:26:19:21 - 01:26:56:10 Speaker 2 Could you sustain that and still bring it back? At that point, I believe the track had been tarmac, so the more things had been done to stop it coming back, the less likelihood of it coming back. So yeah, for me personally, I was sad when it closed in 91 and I was far, far sadder in 2005. And then obviously when the the announcement that the stadium was going to finally close was even was more, more sad because you knew that was the final, you know, the roller coaster had finished and you were told to get off and it was being dismantled. 01:26:56:11 - 01:27:14:15 Speaker 2 Basically, there was no way of coming back while the stadium was still there. There was always the chance that speedway could be reintroduced. If it's a commercial deal, you could bring speedway back, but at the moment the stadium got bulldozed was the moment that Wimbledon speedway finished for good. 01:27:14:17 - 01:27:19:11 Speaker 1 Looking back, what would you say your life as a speedway rider meant to you? 01:27:19:13 - 01:27:57:11 Speaker 2 So yeah, I mean, I didn't make the grade to be a top rider. I got paid to race. I raced for Wimbledon. For me, I was quite happy with that to some degree. Yes, I would like to have done better. I should have dedicated my time more so to to the sport of racing. But that's hindsight. I was lucky to be able to say I've race for Wimbledon and be involved in the things that have gone on after with, you know, the memorabilia and the stuff that's happened at AFC Wimbledon to keep the name alive. 01:27:57:13 - 01:27:59:06 Speaker 2 Yeah, I'd say so, yeah. 01:27:59:08 - 01:28:03:00 Speaker 3 Yeah, it's just two questions. How did you learn to repair and maintain your bike? 01:28:03:04 - 01:28:30:06 Speaker 2 Yeah. So my granddad was a motor mechanic by trade. It was also work for the Mod in the war and he fixed tanks. So we're all always been a mechanical, engineer minded family. My dad was an electrical engineer. He worked for Bankside Power Station on three phase electrical gear. So we're talking big stuff there. So from a mechanical point of view, my dad always had motorbikes as well. 01:28:30:08 - 01:28:53:02 Speaker 2 It was kind of like it was part and parcel of the family. You know, my mum road bikes as well. Motorbikes. I remember before I got my first big bike, my dad had a 190 engine kicking around in the garage and I think it was try and prove that. Did I really want to have a speedway bike? And they said, dismantle the strip, that engine down, see how you get on. 01:28:53:02 - 01:29:15:08 Speaker 2 So I did, I started stripping it down, stripping all the bearings out and big end and stuff like that. And, and I did get my bike for Christmas. But we've always been mechanically minded, you know. So for us when we got into Speedway, we maintain most of the bikes ourselves and the engines. We didn't send them off to engine tuners. 01:29:15:10 - 01:29:35:10 Speaker 2 Dad did the engines. So as I said earlier, Speedway for me meant dad and me. We went hand in hand. I couldn't really do speedway without my dad. He did the bikes and he was with me for the mechanic. And you need someone to trust you can trust and someone you can rely on. And my dad's that person. 01:29:35:12 - 01:30:13:23 Speaker 2 You know, Speedway bikes are very simple things. They're basically bicycles almost with with big engines in them. Oversize bicycles. I mean, there's not a lot to them. There's no gearbox, there's no brakes. It's a single cylinder methanol run engine dropped into a frame with a dry clutch. If you've got any mechanical background, you'll be able to maintain a spray bike and have fun with it as well, because you know you have to clean and strip it down after every meeting, service the engine every 30 to 60 races and that being rings on a on the piston. 01:30:13:23 - 01:30:34:20 Speaker 2 So I learned I learned a lot about combustion engine from being involved in speedway. So we would strip the engine down at home. We'd get the parts that needed from, from, from the, you know, speedway service place and then we'd fit them myself. My dad always said, you know, why are we. Why are we paying for someone to service the engines when we can do it ourselves? 01:30:34:20 - 01:31:00:10 Speaker 2 And we know what we've put inside the engine, and you're racing about. You know what's inside that engine. You know, engine tuning, slightly different. You can tune engines, holy and gas flow, the valves which you can do yourself. And obviously there's different cams you can put into the engines. We did at one point use engines were tuned by German engine tuner. 01:31:00:12 - 01:31:08:21 Speaker 2 But once they're tuned and you can maintain them, then you can keep to a good level of engine spec. 01:31:08:23 - 01:31:19:05 Speaker 3 Okay, my final question. I believe Wimbledon still exists as the Speedway entity. Could you explain what was going on at the Sittingbourne? 01:31:19:07 - 01:31:55:06 Speaker 2 Okay, so Wimbledon Speedway is such it it, does it exist where the Dons Den which is my organization exists and that was born from my own personal speedway memorabilia collection. So as I said earlier, when the speedway club closed, then all representative of the club closed. There is no one who represents Wimbledon Speedway when when the stadium has been knocked down, and the proposal for the football club being brought back to the borough, some people would say, well, why wasn't the speedway mentioned? 01:31:55:07 - 01:32:21:20 Speaker 2 Well, who was representing the speedway? Technically there is no one to represent the speedway. There's no organization, there's no supporters club. Who would someone speak to if they wanted to introduce speedway to a proposal stadium? You know, prior to AFC Wimbledon building this lovely stadium, there was no one. So I set up the Dons Den host, you know, the stadium or at the same time of it being closed. 01:32:22:00 - 01:32:45:09 Speaker 2 And that was just basically about my collection, my own personal memorabilia collection of Wimbledon spread by no artifacts, but it also represented or gave a representation for Wimbledon Speedway because no one was doing it. So I just basically represented the speedway club that didn't technically exist. And I still to this day kind of represent the Speedway of Wimbledon. 01:32:45:11 - 01:33:16:20 Speaker 2 Since I organized the Dons, then I've held memorabilia and reunion events, some very successful ones across the years, and that's brought fans back together. Without that, there wouldn't probably have been a reunion of some sort. There may be, I don't know, there may have been, but it's just about bringing bringing Speedway fans back together and seeing who's still around and who wants to support Speedway. 01:33:16:22 - 01:33:41:15 Speaker 2 So in 2024, where I've been collaborating with Wish Women and Sporting History, with the imminent Ronnie Moore statue on the horizon and me working with Steve Ribbons again, who introduced Speedway back to women in 2002, he was promoting the club Down at Wide and I was actually clerk of the course, so I was actually an official down there. 01:33:41:17 - 01:34:14:07 Speaker 2 So he was coming up with ideas of different matches and I said, let's have a London tournament, you know, let's have something that reminisces for old London supporters. And there come the idea of let's have Wimbledon versus Hackney versus the home club, Kent versus White City. So all old clubs from from London times of before. And that's where it all come about really where we, we come up with the idea concept of having a four team tournament down. 01:34:14:08 - 01:34:39:01 Speaker 2 I weighed it's a lovely summer's day and it was all about getting the supporters from London clubs back down there and just reminiscing really, and having a good day, you know, racing. So it all kind of snowballed a little bit. Firstly it was just going to be sort of a 14 tournament, very low key. And then we thought, well let's let's sort of tap into, you know, wishes contacts. 01:34:39:07 - 01:35:02:20 Speaker 2 We got Kingsley Hamilton involved with the red double decker bus. Great. Kingsley does some great stuff in the borough, charitable events and events. And we got we organized for the bus to bring fans down from pick them up from here, from Wimbledon Stadium, and then take them all day, all the way down to our Wade. It was a great sight, actually, to see a big double decker bus turn up at this this speedway event down in Kent. 01:35:02:21 - 01:35:25:08 Speaker 2 Leafy, leafy I wade. There was lots of Wimbledon support. Was there? Hell of a lot of people in red and yellow. There was also fans of old from Hackney, from the White City days and obviously the home support. So it was a great day of racing. I was I had multiple hats on that day because I was clerk of the course. 01:35:25:09 - 01:35:48:01 Speaker 2 I was also representing the Dons then and steering the sort of dynamics of the day. And I was also assisting with the mascot, the Womble Myrick, the Womble for the day and ensuring that, you know, fans had air horns and smoke grenades and let them off at certain times just to bring a bit of buzz about the place I weighed as a training track. 01:35:48:02 - 01:36:10:15 Speaker 2 It's a leafy, leafy track, so it was about bringing a bit of razzmatazz from from Wimbledon to to leafy Kent, with all the smoke grenades and the noise and the confetti. So yeah, it was a good day. It was really good fun. And it was fun. Yeah. As I said, it needs to be fun. I think it was a commercial success, which is most important as well. 01:36:10:15 - 01:36:19:05 Speaker 2 But it got a lot of fans back together and they just thoroughly enjoyed the day. Yeah, yeah. 01:36:19:07 - 01:36:29:06 Speaker 3 Brilliant. No question. Yeah. About the flashing. Quick, can you tell us a little bit about the fitness of a rider. Yeah. That's changed any more. 01:36:29:08 - 01:36:56:05 Speaker 2 Yeah. So speedway riders generally nowadays have to be quite fit to compete with other races. You need to be on level with them if not better. So the dietary requirements and their weight, the way they maintain the weight as well. Years ago spare riders would have a few points in the bar after smoke as well. And as I said, it was more of an entertainment rather than the sport. 01:36:56:06 - 01:37:17:01 Speaker 2 Has always been a sport, but an athletic sport now, okay, it's about being an athlete on a bike, whereas before it was about being a racer on a motorbike and enjoying it, having a bit of banter and join the day and and the commandery with, with the fans and other riders. So having a few beers after the meeting was just always, always a thing really. 01:37:17:01 - 01:37:45:15 Speaker 2 And as I said, you know, smoking and being fashionable with the time in the 60s 70s it was, you know, spear riders were one of the most fashionable of people, you know, turning up in your, in your best attire. But now it's it's about dedication and being the best that you can be. And, and there's been a lot of education about being the best in your sport and, you know, exercising, eating well. 01:37:45:16 - 01:38:03:17 Speaker 2 I mean, when I was racing, you know, I was training as a gymnast, so I was already kind of halfway there. I always looked after myself. And, you know, I was involved in sports. So it really wasn't a really problem for me. I had good muscle tone as well. So I'd normally normally break your hand when I shake it. 01:38:03:17 - 01:38:06:04 Speaker 2 So there you go.