00:00:00:02 - 00:00:10:15 Speaker 1 This is Ingrid Holtz conducting interview for the Speedway at Wimbledon Stadium Oral History Project on 20th April 2026. So we'll just start with a few basic questions. What is your name? 00:00:10:16 - 00:00:12:14 Speaker 2 Alan Hollamby 00:00:12:16 - 00:00:15:02 Speaker 1 Where were you born? 00:00:15:04 - 00:00:17:12 Speaker 2 Camberwell, London. 00:00:17:14 - 00:00:18:21 Speaker 1 What year was that? 00:00:18:22 - 00:00:20:21 Speaker 2 1956. 00:00:20:23 - 00:00:23:07 Speaker 1 And what did your parents do for a living? 00:00:23:09 - 00:00:47:11 Speaker 2 God. Dad was a local government officer with what was the Greater London Council, but it was the London County Council before that. And my mother, she was a secretary and I think she worked in Clerkenwell. But, you know, obviously that was before I was born. So I don't know that. 00:00:47:13 - 00:00:59:01 Speaker 1 So just talk about the early days when you first went to Speedway. What years did you go to speedway at Wimbledon Stadium? 00:00:59:03 - 00:01:24:19 Speaker 2 1956 to about 67. Now I'm saying 1956. But the reason I'm saying that is that my mum was obviously pregnant when she went to Wimbledon Stadium. So I was before I was born, I was brought into Wimbledon stadiums. So, you know, if you say I can be a fan from the year when, when she turned around and went to Wimbledon. 00:01:24:23 - 00:01:57:12 Speaker 2 But so that was the years I was involved. But before that obviously my mother and father were involved in Wimbledon Speedway. And the story about that first story about that was that my dad, dad used to go with his mum and dad to Wimbledon, and he was a family event, and he sort of said to me mum after him for a few few years, I think it was, how about coming to Wimbledon Speedway thinking there, maybe she wouldn't like it. 00:01:57:14 - 00:02:21:13 Speaker 2 As soon as she went there she was hooked. So of course they continue going through and and obviously I continue with my brother when he was born two years later and went as well. So, you know, of my involvement from 50, about 50 or so, 56 was when I, when I was actually physically born to 67. 00:02:21:15 - 00:02:29:19 Speaker 1 Okay. Can you tell us? Well, maybe not the first visit, but can you tell us about the first visit that you remember to Wimbledon Speedway? 00:02:29:21 - 00:03:06:00 Speaker 2 I can't remember exactly what it was, but I know that, going there, it was sort of, you know, because of where we were based, where we were living in Streatham, you actually hear the bikes, you know, and spell them, but actually hear the bikes sort of on the race days. So when, when it was around, we've obviously, you know, we started, we went I can't remember exactly when it was, but all I know is very, very exciting sort of just to go and, you know, just be part of a family atmosphere. 00:03:06:02 - 00:03:10:19 Speaker 2 That was really what it was. I can't remember exactly what it was. So. 00:03:11:00 - 00:03:12:23 Speaker 1 So did you mostly go with your parents or. 00:03:12:24 - 00:03:23:08 Speaker 2 Yeah, I went my parents. And basically I won't be parents all the way through. Even when women restarted, I was still going to my parents. 00:03:23:10 - 00:03:29:02 Speaker 1 And can you tell us about your early impressions of the sights and sounds and colours? 00:03:29:04 - 00:04:05:12 Speaker 2 Obviously massive for a youngster, a massive, a massive stadium. A lot of people there. But the thing as you get older, you sort of think back and you think this was a there's a set of truly family atmosphere. The, you know, the supporters from both teams were gelling together and that was the big impression sort of as a youngster because, you know, you used to sort of rivalry and you know, with football rivalry sort of everything else in that time. 00:04:05:14 - 00:04:41:23 Speaker 2 But with this, it was a sort of, oh, how can I help you? You know, and fans were sitting with each other and that was probably the biggest impact obviously with the stadium when you got there, you sort of think this is massive. And we went into the, we went into the, the entrance and I know the pit area was to the side, but you couldn't go through the pit area and you had to go right the way around, because where we used to sit was the, the first bend, right in the first bend in a little. 00:04:42:00 - 00:05:18:09 Speaker 2 In one of the boxes there was terracing, and then there was the boxes. And we used to sit there with people and they used to help you out, you know, with all the scores and everything else. So it was a great family atmosphere. And with that there was friendships developed. And I know I'll go back to my mum and dad, but they developed a friendship with somebody that came from Bradford when Bradford came down, and that lasted for years, even when Wimbledon closed and they were able to meet up at least twice, twice after Wimbledon closed, you know, to sort of meet up. 00:05:18:09 - 00:05:28:17 Speaker 2 And it was like yesterday and that, you know, I think that's the atmosphere, the biggest atmosphere sort of thing that I could think of. 00:05:28:19 - 00:05:33:05 Speaker 1 A lot of people mention the smell that it has very special. 00:05:33:07 - 00:05:38:10 Speaker 2 Yeah. It's, you know, it's unique. 00:05:38:12 - 00:06:01:09 Speaker 2 It's difficult to explain, to be honest. But, you know, going on, I might be answering a question later about later after, after Wimbledon closed it's doors. But when we went to the Isle of Wight Speedway, the first thing we didn't even know existed. We were on holiday out there and we go every year, and we went there. 00:06:01:09 - 00:06:32:07 Speaker 2 And you immediately heard the bikes, the roar of something now that could have been caused. But then you smelt the smelt, the smell and it was just something. It was something. It was unique. That's all I can say. It was, you know, I don't know. Perhaps nowadays you could probably say it was health and safety, complete risk with, with it being, being the area it was in and the era, you know, it wasn't and it was. 00:06:32:08 - 00:06:42:19 Speaker 2 So it was a, you know, it was like a methanol, I don't know, methanol and petrol, that's all. I can't really say much. 00:06:42:21 - 00:06:47:23 Speaker 1 Can you tell us any more about the family history with Speedway, about your grandparents? You said you're interested. 00:06:47:24 - 00:07:11:18 Speaker 2 Yeah. Obviously my father went my grandpa with my grandparents. And that was going back probably I didn't sort of don't know exactly what happened, but I know they were going they were going from a very early years and I fortunately I was trying to find out find some of the, the badges which have got a couple of badges that had the years and all. 00:07:11:18 - 00:07:40:16 Speaker 2 My dad, I can't remember what year they had on them then. It was the years I was there or years my mum and dad were there or the granddad was there, but they obviously followed it. And you know, this, that was a working mans class sport. But was it I think a lot of people went because they wanted to be part of a local team, maybe not successful, but I know Wimbledon was very successful. 00:07:40:16 - 00:07:47:21 Speaker 2 But, you know, I think they went and I think they would have gone from the they would have probably gone from the beginning. 00:07:48:02 - 00:07:51:12 Speaker 1 So were they interested in Wimbledon specifically? 00:07:51:18 - 00:08:12:02 Speaker 2 I think when we're in Speedway, I think it's like everything else, it's this sport to go to. It's somewhere to go to. I don't know, I can't say whether they were specifically involved, you know, interested in Wimbledon and Wimbledon Speedway. But over the years, I mean, otherwise they wouldn't have been going for so long if they wouldn't have been interested in it. 00:08:12:02 - 00:08:14:24 Speaker 2 But I never really asked them why. To be honest. 00:08:15:03 - 00:08:19:23 Speaker 1 Your family, were they interested in others tracks as well? 00:08:20:00 - 00:08:45:03 Speaker 2 Yeah, obviously. You know, I touched on, but I've actually written it down. That's why I was thinking that. Now you've said it, obviously my mum and my mother and father, and I'm not quite sure about my grandparents, but I know my mother and father used to visit virtually all the London tracks. And that meant, you know, speedway every night because I think speedway was on different nights. 00:08:45:03 - 00:09:09:10 Speaker 2 I think I can remember something like that happening. And so visited all the London tracks. So they went to West Ham, Harringay and you know. And those are the two I can remember, obviously, New Cross or New Cross, but you know, there was, there was a lot of things and so a lot of the London tracks, obviously it was, it was easier to get to. 00:09:09:11 - 00:09:27:10 Speaker 2 So, you know, I don't not quite sure about my mum and my granddad and my man, but I know my mum and dad used to go, they used to say, well you know, we spent all this time, you know, out. And that's where they went. I followed basically following Wimbledon. 00:09:27:12 - 00:09:35:05 Speaker 1 And we just talk about the experience of going to speedway. Can you describe the stadium? 00:09:35:07 - 00:09:38:12 Speaker 2 Looking at this now? 00:09:38:14 - 00:09:44:07 Speaker 2 Slightly different. 00:09:44:09 - 00:10:10:08 Speaker 2 Like a bowl with I obviously because the stock cars were around you at the, the oval, oval circuit and you had the Greyhound, the Greyhound greyhounds round around the outside of it. So the greyhound track, then you had the speedway track and then you had the stock cars and then you set the middle and where obviously that was figure of eight stuff as well. 00:10:10:08 - 00:10:37:01 Speaker 2 So there was that sort of thing. But that was the sort of track as it was. Obviously the shale was I think it was red shale. I can't remember exactly. But you know, sir, was that the stadium itself was as a youngster, as I said before, it was quite overwhelming. When you first come in, you first came in and you sort of looked at you think, oh, you know, what is this? 00:10:37:05 - 00:11:02:07 Speaker 2 And he went in and you went east, I don't know, he's you felt at home, just the home there. So you feel what it is. And then obviously to get round, I might have said it before, but you get round the stadium, you sort of went in from the went into the pits area where the, where the entrance was near the area, but where we were used to walk right the way around. 00:11:02:07 - 00:11:32:02 Speaker 2 So used to go the long way round underneath, underneath the terracing, around the right, around the outside, the inside the track, right the way around to the first bend. And that was where it was. So it was quite a long walk. And that still meant, you know, the track was big. You know, when I was a bit older, obviously I was doing a lot of athletics, so I know how big the tracks were, but because it was inside, it was inside the dog track. 00:11:32:03 - 00:11:56:19 Speaker 2 It was smaller than perhaps, you know, anywhere else. But, you know, I mean, obviously the starting gate was virtually by right in the middle of the, the Straits. And then you obviously had the grandstands, I think. I can't remember the grandstands. The one the grandstands was, was glassed up. I don't know whether that was on or whether that was later. 00:11:56:21 - 00:12:24:10 Speaker 2 But obviously, you know, you know, sometimes you were forced to sitting in the, in the glass stand and when you were sitting in the grassland, the atmosphere was different because obviously it was the sound was muted. This was going on when it was a bit later. And, you know, to me, you didn't sort of and you didn't really smell as much as what you did. 00:12:24:11 - 00:12:32:04 Speaker 2 I was, were so I was interested in sort of do that. But obviously these were over the years when health and safety started kicking in. 00:12:32:06 - 00:12:34:15 Speaker 1 Was there a particular place you'd like to watch from? 00:12:34:16 - 00:13:03:01 Speaker 2 Yeah, place to work from was to say the first bend. And the reason for that was that's where most of the action started when they come off the gate. And that's where the smashes happened. And, you know, you could see people jostling for the spaces and you were virtually right, right in front of it. So you got to see it first hand rather than if you were sitting on the, you know, in the grandstand or further out, you wouldn't necessarily see it. 00:13:03:07 - 00:13:05:03 Speaker 2 It was like they were going straight at you. 00:13:05:04 - 00:13:06:17 Speaker 1 So it was that a popular pace. 00:13:06:18 - 00:13:09:05 Speaker 2 That was a pretty popular place to get to. Yeah. 00:13:09:07 - 00:13:10:19 Speaker 1 So you have to wrestle to the front. 00:13:10:20 - 00:13:32:20 Speaker 2 Know you got there early enough. Yeah. I mean, say if you got there early enough you could get in and but normally even then if you know, with us, with being youngsters, you know, with me being a youngster, obviously with people there as they saw it, you were you wouldn't, you didn't want to have to stand all the time. 00:13:32:22 - 00:14:04:00 Speaker 2 You could sit on the obviously on the terracing, but you could also sit in the boxes. And obviously where we were, we were we got most of the time we were sitting in the boxes or, you know, the calling boxes, but, you know, it was sort of what they were, you know, they were they were semi boxes, which meant you could actually put your program on the table, sit there and watch it and, you know, write down it without having to sit there with something like a program board. 00:14:04:02 - 00:14:06:06 Speaker 1 How affordable was it to go? 00:14:06:08 - 00:14:36:21 Speaker 2 Must have been affordable to get everybody there. I don't I don't know, I can't remember how much how much it was to be honest. I might never pay for it. So. I don't know, I don't know. It must have been reasonably cheap. But on the other hand, you know, compared to days, Brian, it'll be, I don't know, probably 15 pounds maybe, I don't know, it's it's difficult to work out to be honest. 00:14:36:23 - 00:14:41:09 Speaker 2 Yeah. I wasn't paying for it which is easier. 00:14:41:11 - 00:14:44:01 Speaker 1 And was it always busy. 00:14:44:03 - 00:15:16:12 Speaker 2 Yeah, it was busy obviously people there you met up with quite a few people that were there regular. And you know, that was a sort of, you know, obviously, you know, it obviously some years it was less busy because they weren't as successful as what they what they were before. They did sort of see things drop off. But even then I was I was reasonably, you know, there was quite a few people there. 00:15:16:14 - 00:15:22:18 Speaker 1 Can you tell us about any merchandise and the programs that were available? 00:15:22:20 - 00:15:43:14 Speaker 2 The ones that I can remember, obviously, I'm talking about the early not the resurrected Dons, but the earlier ones. There's a lot of a lot of the programs around here. He was the speedway rider with a woman and style. On the front of it was black and white or whatever. Unfortunately, I couldn't find any of those. 00:15:43:16 - 00:16:08:10 Speaker 2 They're up the stairs in the loft somewhere. But, you know, so obviously they were, you know, about six or maybe eight pages, ten pages long with and obviously the middle bit of it was that was where the scorecard was, you know, where you keep all your feet. So I was about what the riders and the, obviously the race times and everything else like that. 00:16:08:10 - 00:16:33:15 Speaker 2 So that was that obviously had a bit of news about what's going on in the past week, obviously. And you've got the fixtures and the, you know, and what's happened and what is due to happen on the back couple of pages. And obviously there were a few, you know, obviously a few commemorative matches, you know, you test matches and things like that. 00:16:33:17 - 00:16:40:07 Speaker 2 But, you know, I can't remember much of that. That was to be honest. But I know, I know they were around. 00:16:40:09 - 00:16:43:04 Speaker 1 What kind of food and drink was available. 00:16:43:06 - 00:16:47:13 Speaker 2 What food and drink was available. 00:16:47:15 - 00:17:15:07 Speaker 2 Dogs and things like that. And drink. I'm not quite sure about beer because obviously it was too young to drink that, but I think it probably was. There was a bar and obviously soft drinks and but and things like that, obviously. But hot dogs were more were pretty sort of, I think a pretty good, starter. But that's all I can really remember. 00:17:15:08 - 00:17:27:13 Speaker 2 Obviously we, we tend not to do that, which is if we, if we had anything, we had a food before we went and then, you know, and then went to the meeting. 00:17:27:14 - 00:17:37:09 Speaker 1 We're going to have a few questions about being a fan. Can you tell us about any particular riders or teams you followed? 00:17:37:11 - 00:18:03:11 Speaker 2 For the Wimbledon? Obviously in the early years from, you know, so from about 56 through 67, I still follow Wimbledon, but obviously not by physically being there, because obviously by the time you get a secondary school, a lot of homework, so you can't necessarily get out on a Monday night to do things. And I was getting involved with other things as well, which took up a lot of my evenings anyway. 00:18:03:17 - 00:18:26:11 Speaker 2 So we tend to stop doing that. And then so, you know, so obviously you were still it was still some of it on the TV, on the world. I think it was good as well. The sport or grandstand used to have it on and they used to show it some Saturdays, you know, as parts of parts of the, you know, sports programs. 00:18:26:14 - 00:18:53:03 Speaker 2 And then obviously then things went very, very quiet once Wimbledon closed completely, you know, for the first time and then I, then we then, as I say, we went down to, we got to go to on holidays to the Isle of Wight for some time. And 11I think might have been a Tuesday night, probably was a Tuesday night. 00:18:53:05 - 00:19:17:00 Speaker 2 We were sort of driving past small Brook Stadium, where the older white is, and we heard the bikes, we heard the sound of bikes. We weren't sure, but we were pretty sure. And then you say, then you get the smell. And my mum said, go speedway just like that. It was obviously too late to get there because we were driving back after the meeting had started. 00:19:17:01 - 00:19:51:17 Speaker 2 So we went there the next week and and then from then on we were we were there, we went there through when we were there for 3 or 3 weeks on the summer and we were down on holiday every so every was every Tuesday or whenever they changed the nights, every week we were there. We went once a week to the Isle of Wight Speedway, and that was from about 9596 through to 2000 and. 00:19:51:19 - 00:20:19:14 Speaker 2 2009, when that was when my mum and dad passed away. Or, you know, at that particular time and I know it took me that the, the, the year after my mum died and that was the last time we went into thousand. No, it would be 2008. Sorry. 2008. And, and I then continued to go until 2012. And then I stopped going to the Isle of Wight. 00:20:19:16 - 00:20:51:12 Speaker 2 So obviously that was my speedway fix. I still I still used to get hold of the speedway star to keep, you know, keeping track of what was going on generally. And then obviously then when women restarted back again in 2000 and 2002, I think it was when they restarted, I then came, we then came back and then, you know, supported them right the way through and saw the closure. 00:20:51:16 - 00:21:15:22 Speaker 2 And so, you know, so what we were doing was obviously when women was here, we were at Wimbledon when we were at home. And then obviously we've still got a speedway fixed rest of the year at that. And I also went one year, I can't remember exactly when it was, but I was down in Eastbourne for near Eastbourne for a weekend and I thought, what about going down to Eastbourne Speedway? 00:21:15:23 - 00:21:58:14 Speaker 2 And I went down to Eastbourne Speedway and down at Arlington. I went there for, you know, just sort of experienced this just to see what the top league was like, because obviously, you know, being used to the Premier League and the, the Conference League. But the thing that I, the thing I did notice about that was there wasn't much difference between the top two riders and the bottom two riders in relation to the, you know, the speed of the, the speeds and and generally the distance between the if they, if they were totally different. 00:21:58:18 - 00:22:19:12 Speaker 2 And obviously the difference between the two wasn't much different. So what it was in the Conference League. And to me that was you know, it was interesting. And also some of the riders were people that I seen on the Isle of Wight, I have seen at Wimbledon, I can't remember, but, you know, it was interesting to see them in the top league. 00:22:19:14 - 00:22:28:07 Speaker 2 You know, I think, you know, it really gone on. You've seen them as a youngster, you know, developing and you know so it was really good to do that. 00:22:28:08 - 00:22:32:08 Speaker 1 Did you have any favourite riders. 00:22:32:10 - 00:22:37:02 Speaker 2 I think Trevor. 00:22:37:04 - 00:23:04:17 Speaker 2 Running more obviously. I think that's a, you know, and there was another one, Reg Luckhurst and I think Jim Tibby and as I say, Tim Tibby, I think Jim Tibby was a you may know it as well, but was he the tubby one? I think I think I'm maybe sort of, but I don't know, I think, I think he was sort of, but he was a totally different rider. 00:23:04:17 - 00:23:29:11 Speaker 2 But he was a good number two to Trevor Hedge as the number one. And but the thing was, you know, with Wimbledon you saw a lot of team riding. And whereas with other clubs you sort of saw I'm number one, I'm leaving you behind. And I think that was the big thing as well with, with Wimbledon. And you saw a lot of team riding and went. 00:23:29:13 - 00:23:51:12 Speaker 2 When we went to The Wire, you saw it and he saw it in a different way, but you could still see it was it was happening. And he thought, oh yeah, this had been done. So yeah, those are the obviously there was I think Ollie Nygen was around either towards the end of my time I was just Cyril Maidment, people like that. 00:23:51:16 - 00:24:23:06 Speaker 2 And there was a youngster here and I'm talking about, you know, the new Dons, Andrew Barr, who was brought in here, who was brought in as youngster. And I'd seen him in on the Isle of Wight and it was interesting to see how they were. I mean, you know, obviously talking about more recent ones, I mean, there was John Armstrong and there was 00:24:23:08 - 00:24:52:19 Speaker 2 The manager of Chris. Chris. Chris Hunt, him and there was a few others that that were around in the later years. And obviously I knew Chris Hunt from, you know, he was when he was riding all over the place. So, you know, it's interesting. So you sort of but the thing was what it was you talk about you saw about Ronnie Moore and Barry Briggs and Cyril Mabon. 00:24:52:21 - 00:25:18:12 Speaker 2 The thing the difference was between a lot of people that are, you know, holier than thou sort of thing or, you know, I don't want to touch him. I don't want to talk to him. They were very approachable. And I think that was the thing again, about Wimbledon. I don't know whether it was in all other places, but the riders were prepared to spend time to talk to the people that were there. 00:25:18:12 - 00:25:37:16 Speaker 2 And if you ask questions about they were prepared to do it. And they were they were there with signing autographs and they were actually, you know, being part of the people as well. So they didn't let fame go to them. Whereas some people, some so famous, you know, you've got to pay for my autograph. But they, they didn't. 00:25:37:18 - 00:25:49:23 Speaker 2 You had it all happening. And that was the, that was another thing that you, you thought, you know, I thought was really good about the whole, the whole situation. 00:25:50:00 - 00:25:58:19 Speaker 1 What was the general demographic graphic of the fans in terms of gender, ethnicity, families? 00:25:58:21 - 00:26:02:16 Speaker 2 It's a good question. 00:26:02:18 - 00:26:06:18 Speaker 2 I think. 00:26:06:20 - 00:26:32:07 Speaker 2 I think I don't know, it was mainly it's difficult to sort of say I think it was mainly white people. But on the other hand, you know, you don't. I mean, it's me. To me it doesn't matter. So that's what I'm saying. But obviously the mix was very family oriented. It wasn't all blokes. You got a football matches and it's all blokes, a few women and it goes women football. 00:26:32:09 - 00:26:53:08 Speaker 2 But you know, but again the mix was, was a relatively I think it was a good balanced mixed obviously. And there was children, there was a family there. And again, that's why, you know, with the Isle of Wight Speedway, it was the same sort of thing. It was a very, very similar atmosphere when you went down there. 00:26:53:10 - 00:27:06:04 Speaker 2 And so I would think, you know, I suppose I don't necessarily notice much about the most much about colour myself. So I don't know. 00:27:06:06 - 00:27:09:06 Speaker 1 Can you tell us about any rivalries with other teams? 00:27:09:08 - 00:27:36:15 Speaker 2 There was always a big rivalry with West Ham and New Cross, but on the other hand it was a friendly rivalry. You know, you know, I don't think as anything there was anything sort of, you know, like some things where you get, you know, punch ups and everything else. It was more, oh, you know. Oh yeah, we're there to watch the sport. 00:27:36:17 - 00:28:07:07 Speaker 2 Even though there was a big following from different, different clubs. And so I guess I didn't, I didn't notice it. It might have been going on, but again I didn't notice it. And I don't think even later on in 2002 I didn't notice it. Then. You know, as an older person. Because I think people just wanted to come and watch this, watch his sport. 00:28:07:09 - 00:28:10:20 Speaker 1 So does that mean there wasn't much police but many police? 00:28:10:22 - 00:28:36:10 Speaker 2 There must have been there was police around. There were still stewards around. But I don't think again, if they were I don't think they were. They were majorly around like you can get with certain by the places. So you know, you know, obviously with the big crowds, like if you had The Internationale or, you know, the, the test matches and then there was probably more police presence around because because of the nature of it. 00:28:36:10 - 00:28:47:24 Speaker 2 And you were getting people not necessarily coming from, you know, Britain, you were getting from all over the all over the place and all over the all over England and Wales, Scotland and Ireland. 00:28:48:01 - 00:28:54:14 Speaker 1 How important was Wimbledon Speedway in your social life? 00:28:54:16 - 00:29:01:22 Speaker 2 I think as a youngster it was important because. 00:29:01:24 - 00:29:28:14 Speaker 2 You, you were able to mix with people without being, without being afraid of anything. You know, this whole thing about we shouldn't talk to strangers. But, you know, in that situation, you could you could talk to people because, again, they were prepared to help you out, like, you know, same with us. If we found somebody that had been completely new. 00:29:28:14 - 00:29:53:17 Speaker 2 Speedway, you know, which does happen, which did happen, that you get like that where you actually say to him all. Do you understand? Do you understand how this works? Because until you get used to it, it's crazy, the sort of scoring system and everything else like that. And why is it? Why does the rider get excluded? Why does it do this? 00:29:53:21 - 00:30:19:06 Speaker 2 You know, so it's interesting to sort of, you know, have the rules and regulations and things like that. So you know, to me it was, it was a, it was grounding in some ways in the sense that you were with your family, but you felt you, you could go, you could go and you could go to the loo or whatever and know you're going to be safe. 00:30:19:08 - 00:30:29:22 Speaker 2 It was there was a a safer environment. And I mean, this is my experience. It may be different for some other people, but that was my experience, that it was safe. 00:30:29:24 - 00:30:32:21 Speaker 1 Did you make friends with other children when you were? 00:30:32:23 - 00:30:54:00 Speaker 2 I think I did, but obviously over the years they've gone. I know I've got a friend who who actually told about this, but obviously it was a bit too late to get him getting involved who actually was actually worked on the on the track at Wimbledon as well. So and I mean, I've known him. He's about the same age as me. 00:30:54:00 - 00:31:24:12 Speaker 2 So, you know, I've known him and I didn't necessarily know him as a Speedway fan back in, you know, back when I was a youngster, but when obviously as, as we grew older and obviously got involved in youth work ourselves. I was saying, oh yeah, I used to go there and I know when I go, go back to when we were and restarted, he came along with us and we sat there and we went virtually every, every week it was on, you know, that and sat together. 00:31:24:12 - 00:31:56:15 Speaker 2 So, you know, friendships were there and I think there were friendships around. But obviously as youngsters you tend to, you know, if your parents have got friends, then they become friends and then they become it's not, you know, they become friends and they keep in contact with the answers with, with themselves. But if you if you're younger, you tend to, you know, you forget them or I do if you get about, you know, you're there to watch something or to be with people. 00:31:56:17 - 00:32:02:24 Speaker 1 Can you tell us about relationships with other people? Sort of been saying that, but did people go to the pubs or. 00:32:03:01 - 00:32:29:13 Speaker 2 I think people did later on afterwards. They did afterwards. We didn't, obviously, because we were, you know, we were sort of youngsters obviously. So we had to get back for get back for school the next morning and things like that. So we didn't. But I know, I know they used to go and is it the pub that was on is now a well, there's two pubs that were that were on the corner and was, I can't remember because it called The Plow. 00:32:29:15 - 00:32:46:05 Speaker 2 I can't remember what their names, I can't remember what the name was. Two pubs on the on the one on the end of Power Lane with around Little Roundabout is on one side and the other one over that side as well. And there was another one down at. 00:32:46:07 - 00:33:16:09 Speaker 2 Down at Garrett Lane. Down that way. I've come in some down, down that way. There was another pub there. Now they're no longer pubs, so it just shows you what happened when. Sorry woman and stadium. Well when women had stadium stopped before it became this Wimbledon stadium. You know the pubs, the pub trenches went. You know, so three pubs have closed, so you know, so I say we didn't. 00:33:16:09 - 00:33:36:21 Speaker 2 But, you know, obviously it was our choice. But you know, we know very well people did go afterwards to sort of reminisce about, about what was going on because what we used to do obviously, although there was the main event, there used to be the novices and the youngsters and the people sort of training their as well without their own race as well. 00:33:36:21 - 00:33:43:11 Speaker 2 So we stayed 30 to that finished and by that time the stadium was pretty empty. 00:33:43:13 - 00:33:46:00 Speaker 1 So novices were doing their races. 00:33:46:01 - 00:34:08:10 Speaker 2 Yeah they did. Yeah. Because obviously at the main event and then you had like the, you know, the youngsters or the people that were sort of come up and coming before the obviously I've thought about before the Conference League and things like that. So there was like a few races afterwards where, where they had their own mini race, mini race for four laps and everything else. 00:34:08:15 - 00:34:14:11 Speaker 2 So, you know, because obviously there was a training track for, for youngsters as well. 00:34:14:13 - 00:34:18:15 Speaker 1 Can you tell us about any fan clubs? Did you ever join a fan club? 00:34:18:16 - 00:34:21:06 Speaker 2 Not really. 00:34:21:08 - 00:34:22:08 Speaker 1 Did they exist? 00:34:22:09 - 00:34:41:15 Speaker 2 I think they must have existed. But obviously, you know, you we tend not to. So I mean, obviously you were following, but as I say, you were still following Wimbledon. Obviously when it was in the papers you were reading what was going on. But no, no fan clubs as as such. 00:34:41:20 - 00:34:51:13 Speaker 1 Okay. Did you have any particular hero that you admired when you were a child that has the Speedway heroes? 00:34:51:15 - 00:35:18:01 Speaker 2 I think I think again, Ronnie more because he was, you know, he was everything, you know, the way he wrote the road, the tracks where he looked after when he was riding with other people, you know, as a team, he made sure that they they were all right. So of course, you know, he got maximum scores rather than, you know, just me being me and things like that. 00:35:18:01 - 00:35:45:04 Speaker 2 So again, that was sort of the thing about teamwork and, and things like that, you know, which, which, you know, sort of that's what I admired really about a person. And also because the person the way he was, you know, he was sort of, oh yeah, I've done this, you know, big. Yeah. We met him, obviously met him obviously later on. 00:35:45:10 - 00:36:05:10 Speaker 2 You know, when, when, when I had the, you know, reopening and everything else and things like that. See you know, you met him and it's just, you know, obviously a lot older than him, but you know, it was still, you know, still the person you were more. Could you tell us a bit about Trevor? I'm only asking because we might. 00:36:05:10 - 00:36:06:05 Speaker 3 Be interviewing him. 00:36:06:09 - 00:36:27:03 Speaker 2 Oh, right. Okay. Trevor age, I think, again, a great writer, and I think he was he was another rider that was sort of there. And he did a lot of things that I know he was with different clubs as well. And I think he was he was really good. It was really good at a rider as the number one. 00:36:27:04 - 00:36:50:03 Speaker 2 And he was again, he was another one. I think it was I think it was I don't know, it must have been the Wimbledon mentality of developing other riders. You know, you may say something different, but I think that's how I saw it was when he was riding with people. It was always sort of, you know, get the maximum out of this. 00:36:50:03 - 00:37:15:06 Speaker 2 Don't, don't think about myself. Although, you know, getting these maximum scores so I can get maximum, you know, extra points and extra money. So it was that type of thing. I think the team was the team was the, you know, was the thing I was talking about team riding obviously, you know, with regards individually, I think he was he was a good writer, you know, really good rider. 00:37:15:07 - 00:37:42:07 Speaker 2 Obviously. I think it proved with, you know, winning certain things. I can't remember exactly 1 in 1, but you know, things like that. But the, you know, I think again, Gavin, Gavin, his son, he obviously I think he wrote of Wimbledon or he might have not I think it might have been Wimbledon later on and, might get mixed up. 00:37:42:13 - 00:38:03:00 Speaker 2 You might have been. Yeah, I think it was one. But I think, you know, to see him down in the pits, helping him out, I'm thinking, yeah, you know, and things like that. So, you know, he sort of he didn't give up when he, when he stopped, he just carried on as he was and you know, supported whatever. 00:38:03:01 - 00:38:11:22 Speaker 2 He supported as much as he can. And he even supported women with him, you know, during the later years as well. And developing people. 00:38:11:24 - 00:38:17:22 Speaker 1 Okay. Can you tell us about a memorable night of speed? 00:38:17:24 - 00:38:24:17 Speaker 2 Not missing any memorable ones? Yeah, I think, 00:38:24:19 - 00:38:54:07 Speaker 2 I think obviously the most memorable one is the one clearest in my memory was when Wimbledon restarted back in 2002. Because. And that's the one I remember because obviously people were saying, you've got to get there early to get in. And I know we got there early and the crowds were just immense. You know, they were how many people you can't count. 00:38:54:10 - 00:39:16:22 Speaker 2 It was car park was full. And, you know, I mean, we went we traveled by bus. But I remember still walking down, walking down towards the stadium was thinking, God, there's a lot of people here, there's a lot of people. And then you sort of standing and queuing and waiting and are you going to get in? Obviously you got in and it was just an amazing atmosphere to start. 00:39:16:22 - 00:39:31:10 Speaker 2 And I think, I think it was that night that obviously the weather was not the best for that, for that, that meeting, and it seemed to take forever. 00:39:31:12 - 00:39:51:15 Speaker 2 But obviously they got through it. But it was obviously because there was a lot of things going on that, you know, was just, you know, crashes and things because the track was, was not, not, I don't know, perhaps if it wouldn't have been that night, they wouldn't might have called it off. But I think yes, there was that. 00:39:51:15 - 00:40:14:13 Speaker 2 But it was just, it was just the atmosphere. And you think, oh, you know, this is this is amazing that all these people just want to come and watch women and speedway or even not, sorry, watch Wimbledon Speedway, but to watch speedway in London because I think I'm not quite sure, but I think this was the only track that was available around. 00:40:14:15 - 00:40:44:02 Speaker 2 Again, I might be wrong, but I think, you know, because I think most of the others that time the closed and you know, and that's the that's the biggest sadness that I think I've got that you just haven't got anything. You've got everybody you've got to go. He's got to go miles away to see Speedway. And even then, you know, even in the, the tracks are gradually closing and I somehow reopening. 00:40:44:02 - 00:41:13:07 Speaker 2 But you know, not necessarily right. But I think that was the most memorable one. Obviously the the worst one was obviously in 2005 when you know that the laurels in the last meeting, knowing that, you know, Wimbledon was going to close because of the situation, I won't so much more. But the situation and although there was sort of moves afoot to try to get Wimbledon into another place, you know, it never happened. 00:41:13:08 - 00:41:28:01 Speaker 2 And I think that one was when I think, it was Burrows, I think one that won the laurels on that particular occasion. And, and it was like, great, he's won it. 00:41:28:03 - 00:42:05:09 Speaker 2 What's going to happen next? Who's going to is it going to be able to, you know, retain you know, you know, go again and sort of sort of be able to, you know, go again and ride against it and you know, so it was that sort of thing, you know, when, you know, so that was the sort of the to and obviously, you know, I suppose the other ones that not necessarily I can remember specifically, but when they are going, going to the current history was when I was resurrected, the first first test match back in when it was. 00:42:05:09 - 00:42:27:23 Speaker 2 But I mean, when I did that, and I seen the notes, but, you know, when they did that and they resurrected that and they sort of did a commemorative, you know, leaflet for that and program for that. And. Yeah, but those are the sort of things that I can necessarily remember. 00:42:28:00 - 00:42:40:06 Speaker 1 Okay. We're just going back to a more general, excuse me, can you tell us about any other entertainment on speedway nights? Was it any music, anything else happening? 00:42:40:08 - 00:43:10:04 Speaker 2 Obviously the I used to have, I think again, I'm getting confused because some when you think about it, you think about what was it like back in 60s, what it was like back in at in 2000? I think they used to do is to have music between the year, between the races and things that that was necessarily wasn't. 00:43:10:06 - 00:43:33:24 Speaker 2 You know, I can't remember much of it, but I know there was sort of music and obviously announcements and, you know, things like that. So there was a few music obviously the the theme tune was Blows Away, you know, at the beginning and they when they used to sort of, you know, then they'd bring the riders on and then introduced the riders one by one as they, as they came in. 00:43:34:01 - 00:43:57:16 Speaker 2 And obviously towards the end, you know, when, when the victory lap, you know, on the, on the tractor, you know, I think they used to play music then, but I can't remember. I'm talking about the back in the back in the times. I think they, they tended to do that as well. Later on in the 2000 as well. 00:43:57:20 - 00:44:02:18 Speaker 2 But again don't ask me to, to sort of sing Brace Away because I can't remember. 00:44:02:18 - 00:44:11:03 Speaker 1 It was the victory. I've seen it on a video victory lap on a tractor. Was that did everybody do that at all the stadiums? Is that the tradition or was it. 00:44:11:05 - 00:44:19:07 Speaker 2 The ones that one? Obviously I can only go by the ones that have seen I know. 00:44:19:09 - 00:44:47:07 Speaker 2 They, they sometimes do. I know the Isle of Wight used to do it, but then they decided what they do is they get the riders to ride round, you know, rather than put them on a tractor, but they used to put them on tractor Eastbourne, I think they did at Eastbourne. But again I'm not sure. So I, I would think it might have been something that they did, you know, with one. 00:44:47:09 - 00:45:06:14 Speaker 2 Thank you fans for supporting us. Thank you for this. And you know, so people can sort of show their appreciation to the team as it was a team rather than just two riders. Each particular, each particular, you know, race. 00:45:06:16 - 00:45:11:17 Speaker 1 Did you ever travel to away meetings or overseas like Poland? 00:45:11:18 - 00:45:39:15 Speaker 2 No, I never did that. I was, I was thinking about going to Cardiff when obviously the, you know, the big events were on in the championships room, you know, in Cardiff. But I never, I never actually did that. I know my mum and dad obviously went and I did go to Bradford outside of London. That's where they, you know, sometimes a long time later on. 00:45:39:17 - 00:46:09:21 Speaker 2 So, but you know, but I never actually physically went outside of the UK mainly because, you know being a youngster you don't tend to and also as an older person, I had other things going on as well. So, you know, I suppose I don't know nowadays with TV you can see it on TV, so why pay? I know it's the atmosphere. 00:46:09:23 - 00:46:34:14 Speaker 2 It'd be great to do it, but I never had I never had the inclination to sort of go and visit the other tracks, apart from the ones that I, that I knew, mainly because it was only really women in here. And I think a lot of it was travel, you know, about getting anywhere and even different places. I don't think so. 00:46:34:16 - 00:46:44:16 Speaker 1 Okay. Can you just speaking generally, what was the role of speedway, along with other sports in the area, like the football and the and the greyhounds and stock cars? 00:46:44:18 - 00:47:24:18 Speaker 2 Obviously you had the football stadium to the cross across the road there. But again was, was was great. I, I never went there, but I can hear from different people again. It was a family saw stated team obviously when women and was Wimbledon not not have see Wimbledon and and obviously with that one obviously the biggest disappointment was when they decided to up and go up to Milton Keynes and we thought that that's, that's killed, basically killed women and football. 00:47:24:23 - 00:47:55:15 Speaker 2 But obviously then they brought AFC Wimbledon, you know, back down to King's Meadow and places like that. And they started off as scratch. And I think, you know seeing a club go from nothing. And I'm saying it's happened here as well. But seeing a club go from nothing to the top, you know, the top division and even winning, you know, even winning the FA Cup was just, was just something it was, you know, is it, is it a fairy tale? 00:47:55:17 - 00:48:21:19 Speaker 2 It proved. It proved to other people this can happen. And I think that was that was obviously one of the things that was around here. I never went to I never went to the stocks or the greyhounds here when it was on this stadium. Mainly because I think greyhound racing was to me wasn't the best thing, you know, for the dogs. 00:48:21:21 - 00:48:49:06 Speaker 2 And I thought, do I want to do it? And also it was a big betting thing as well, which is, you know, sorry, you know, it's on my gains. And you're thinking, yeah, you know, why, why put all these dogs through knowing that they can be in a situation of, you know, once they stop running, then they put down basically, you know, put it bluntly, I know some I looked after, but, you know, if you don't perform, you've had it. 00:48:49:08 - 00:49:18:14 Speaker 2 And I think so that put me off of that stock cars again I was thinking do I don't I but I, I never really felt like, you know going to be honest. So that was that. So obviously that was the three here. You know, the three major things. And I think, you know, that's where it was. 00:49:18:16 - 00:49:31:00 Speaker 1 Okay, I'm going to just talk about how things changed. So how did Wimbledon's speedway change over time when you were watching? 00:49:31:02 - 00:49:57:18 Speaker 2 I don't think it changed that much, to be honest. I don't obviously I'm looking I'm looking at the first years, first set of years, obviously the fan base started to drop off and that was probably the biggest thing. And I think mainly I think because, you know, you had TV, you had other you have other things going on and perhaps it might have been starting to get more expensive. 00:49:57:20 - 00:50:39:11 Speaker 2 Perhaps, you know, it was before. It didn't seem to be the working man, sport, I know some you had a lot of different people going that were, you know, having boxes and places like that and the cost of boxes and obviously costs were probably going through a roof. So I think that was that. Obviously later on when women restarted, I think the fan base probably might have changed a bit. 00:50:39:13 - 00:51:07:19 Speaker 2 Was there was more perhaps there were obviously the there were obviously parents and, and parents of people that were like myself who would have been children at the time, have gone. And then there was obviously people because it was women. And restarting was sort of inquisitive and obviously, again, obviously with a big, a big thing for the first couple of years or first year or so, you know, a lot of people watching. 00:51:07:19 - 00:51:40:06 Speaker 2 But then things started to drift off, mainly because people I don't know, people wanted a successful team. And if you're not a successful team, you're going to start losing people again. That might have been a different it might have been a different attitude. I mean, never, never worried us, but, you know, but that was an attitude. So I think, you know, those are sort of the, the two sort of differences maybe that there were. 00:51:40:08 - 00:51:46:09 Speaker 1 Okay, how did the closure of Wimbledon Speedway affect you? 00:51:46:11 - 00:52:09:15 Speaker 2 Obviously when it closed, first time it affected me because you couldn't hear anything. You couldn't hear the bikes running. It didn't affect me that much because obviously, you know, I hadn't been for so long, but obviously it was a big disappointment that women in speedway had gone because, you know, because of problems that were going on at the time. 00:52:09:17 - 00:52:59:10 Speaker 2 And so it was a it was like, you know, a women's speedway would have probably, you know, generated some work for some people as well. So for that situation, it was a big it was a disappointment. So but it wasn't perhaps as much as what obviously when after reopening, you know, and then closing in 2005, that was probably a bigger influence because I felt that why, you know, I know it was money, but, it was why can't, you know, why can't people, you know, support something that is going to be around and, and generate something not necessarily generate mega money, but generate enough? 00:52:59:11 - 00:53:26:15 Speaker 2 I mean, I was I was also, you know, myself mum and dad were with shareholders as well, obviously not major shareholders. But when they offered the shares out to individuals and we had season tickets as well. So you know, it was the sort of thing about oh yeah. Well why you know, and obviously, you know, I know Ian Perkin was sort of trying to find other tracks that would accommodate. 00:53:26:16 - 00:53:53:11 Speaker 2 And I, they went to down at Sittingbourne, you know, places like that for a little while to try to try to do things. And it turned out the owner actually bought the only was it Hearn's was the owner I can't remember. Okay. Yeah. Kane's who actually bought sitting or his family bought Sitting Bull. I was thinking, great, we're going to have stadium down. 00:53:53:12 - 00:54:21:15 Speaker 2 I tried it a bit, but it didn't work. And obviously now I don't. I don't even know whether the two stadiums are these be two stadiums down there, that are now, you know, perhaps being used. And I used to have Kent Kings and somebody else down there, but you know, so obviously it was a big disappointment because you felt like, yes, you've lost something yet again and again. 00:54:21:16 - 00:54:44:01 Speaker 2 It's, it's money and, you know, but unfortunately that's how things go. And I think a lot of a lot of things was, you know, the fan base probably wasn't as popular as what it was. And going back to the going back on before my time, but the 30s when it was so, so popular, you know, when really sized crowds. 00:54:44:03 - 00:54:53:20 Speaker 2 But now, now it was like you couldn't feel couldn't feel grandstand was restricted, but you couldn't feel one grandstand. 00:54:53:22 - 00:54:58:08 Speaker 1 How did it feel to go the last time at Wimbledon? Do you remember the last time you went? 00:54:58:09 - 00:55:04:01 Speaker 2 Yeah, that was the so that was that Lord. And it was sort of. 00:55:04:03 - 00:55:32:01 Speaker 2 So sad. I think that you just didn't get you weren't going to see anything. You know, although the hope was there, you weren't going to see anything at Wimbledon. You weren't going to see speedway. And Speedway in London had gone basically. You know, and obviously later on everything went obviously got woman and focused him here now. But why couldn't they were both. 00:55:32:03 - 00:55:41:03 Speaker 1 Looking back. What did Wimbledon Speedway mean to you. 00:55:41:05 - 00:55:44:03 Speaker 2 I think. 00:55:44:05 - 00:55:48:19 Speaker 2 The family atmosphere. 00:55:48:21 - 00:55:57:06 Speaker 2 The camaraderie between rival supporters. 00:55:57:08 - 00:56:33:21 Speaker 2 You despite being, you know, rivals, they were they were friends and also I mean, you know going to something that you could you knew I don't know. You knew you couldn't participate in but you knew that there was so much risk involved, you know, no brakes, just acceleration on what wouldn't have that in a car, you know, and you know, and and being so frail, more so frail machinery, machines. 00:56:33:21 - 00:56:54:11 Speaker 2 I mean, if you see, you know, you see some of the crashes, you think, how is he going to come out of that? And they get up. I know there are some that are fatal, but, you know, but on the other hand, you know, majority of crashes that people had, a bike was completely mangled, but the people were standing up. 00:56:54:13 - 00:57:22:22 Speaker 2 And I think this note for note to 60 in so many seconds, you know, you think, you know, you wouldn't be doing that in a car without without any, any barriers or something. And I think that that was sort of the thing, you know, you know, in some ways that perhaps some might have been, might have been tempted few years ago to sort of get on a to do first skid. 00:57:22:24 - 00:57:31:17 Speaker 2 At the Isle of Wight years ago, I was thinking, why don't you try and have. No. 00:57:31:19 - 00:57:53:08 Speaker 2 I don't want to take a chance. But knowing people were sort of basically putting their lives in their own hands, you know, for very, you know, I know nowadays it's for a lot of money, but for very, very little money, you know, points money twice named for nothing, basically. 00:57:53:10 - 00:57:56:19 Speaker 1 I mean, was it the thrill for the riders? 00:57:56:21 - 00:58:41:02 Speaker 2 I think it must have been a thrill for the riders because, you know, in some ways you think, oh, is it, are we are they just being idiots? You know, because you see the way you throw the bikes around. But but you know, you knew there was a skill involved. I mean, you know, you can't. I know again, looking back, you know, over the later years when you were actually seeing youngsters sort of falling out the first at the first bend and then a few years later, seeing them mastering it and going around like, you know, virtually not necessarily record track times, but, you know, people like that, you think, God, this is crazy. 00:58:41:03 - 00:59:13:16 Speaker 2 I know Wimbledon was a pretty small track. You know, it's just sort of, you know, go around in relation to some of the other tracks. But, you know, there was nowhere to go, you know, apart from around the track or in the curb, on the inside or in the, in the, in the fencing. You know, I think there was a lot of that, you know, you sort of think, well, you know, I think we might just say one mind idiots. 00:59:13:16 - 00:59:38:06 Speaker 2 But on the other hand, you're thinking, oh, that's just, it's just, I don't know, right. Word for it. Artists in what they do, specialists in what they do, they know what they're doing. They know how to handle a bike. They know what they're doing. And it's that type of thing. You think this is amazing when you can see somebody doing it? 00:59:38:06 - 00:59:57:00 Speaker 2 I know, you know, when you see them, see them out on the on the roadway, you know, with a 250 CCS and things like that. You think, yeah, but you couldn't handle you couldn't handle a motorbike on a restricted track. So that. Oh, okay. 00:59:57:02 - 01:00:04:14 Speaker 1 Is there anything you'd like to tell us that we haven't yet covered? 01:00:04:16 - 01:00:32:13 Speaker 2 Not really. I can't think of anything. I just, I think, you know, when you when you look back. Obviously it spans quite a few years and it's obviously this gaps in between. But I think, you know, looking back, you know obviously I missed by when it, when it wasn't around. In some ways I miss it now because obviously I don't go to the Isle of Wight, you know that sort of that often. 01:00:32:15 - 01:00:47:18 Speaker 2 And you know, you sort of think more. It's a big 60 or 50, 12 years. 01:00:47:20 - 01:01:25:13 Speaker 2 14, 15 over about 30 years. There's probably less than half of my life I've been watching Speedway or, you know, supporting a team, irrespective of which team it is. You know, I think it's that type of thing. And I think that's the sort of thing you, you, you think about your , before Matthew started asking me about I was I was thinking, well, you know, is it you know, I don't think about it. 01:01:25:14 - 01:01:56:00 Speaker 2 It's just something that's happened. But then when you get people start asking the questions, you think, yeah, it does, but it does. It does make a difference. I think, again, you know, it's this sort of not necessarily me personally, but I think, you know, the friendships that people developed that were like when you meet up with them again after so many years, I can't remember exactly when my mum and dad met with these, these two people from Bradford, and I can't remember her names. 01:01:56:03 - 01:02:11:08 Speaker 2 I wouldn't I won't say them just in case. I can't remember them. Not right. But I know that, when they met up, it was like yesterday. And, you know, you think this is crazy? 01:02:11:10 - 01:02:14:17 Speaker 1 How long ago did you last go to Ireland? 01:02:14:19 - 01:02:41:04 Speaker 2 Someone would see. All the while it was 2012, 13 years, 14 years ago now. So I've not been back speedway for about 14 years, although I've seen it on TV. I've got got, you know, not Sky sports, but BT sports that pick it up, somebody on ESPN. But you know, so I've lost I've not necessarily lost track of it. 01:02:41:04 - 01:03:10:03 Speaker 2 But on the other hand I sort of think, you know, it. It's like everything, you know, there's a time for there's times for certain things. And I think personally, I think if women if Wimbledon was here, if there was a local track, I'd probably be going down there. That's the way I look at it. But as there's not and, you know, it takes forever to get and it takes forever to get here sometimes. 01:03:10:04 - 01:03:14:14 Speaker 2 But, you know, I mean, it takes forever to get to these places. 01:03:14:16 - 01:03:18:00 Speaker 1 Okay. Does do you have any questions? 01:03:18:02 - 01:03:21:09 Speaker 2 Well, I'm interested in what you can say. 01:03:21:12 - 01:03:33:08 Speaker 4 About what you would say about the situation when it finally closed down, because you sort of mentioned it, but we don't really know what happened when it finally closed down. 01:03:33:10 - 01:04:07:05 Speaker 2 I don't know, I don't know the full story. All I know, all I know is that they, they, the, the owners, current owners, and I personally think this been going on since Wimbledon started in restarted back in 2002. Is that the at the time the Greyhound Association I think which weren't it was known by the ground so shows by another capital company and they were not happy with Wimbledon being there originally. 01:04:07:07 - 01:04:35:13 Speaker 2 But and, but they, they let them in because it was like a mission to fail. I think this is my personal you know, I might be completely wrong, but and obviously over a period of time, they started increasing the rents. And obviously the the, stadium manager at the time was asked to increase the rent to such an astronomical event. 01:04:35:13 - 01:04:53:02 Speaker 2 And I know women. And so I lost quite a bit of money in one year because of all the rain offs that we had. And that's the biggest problem with Speedway is that if the track is to wait, you can't run. And that means if you're paying for people, you're paying all these people to do these things, you still got to pay. 01:04:53:02 - 01:05:38:06 Speaker 2 You got any money to come in? So I think there was a lot of that. And obviously so obviously when when the final sort of straw came in 2005 about the situation of, you know, closure because it was just so expensive because the rent was just too much. I, I had a suspicion at the time, and in some ways, it's come through in the sense that they knew Wimbledon Football Club had gone from across the road and had made mega, mega money on building on the old football and football club. 01:05:38:08 - 01:06:07:16 Speaker 2 And I don't I'm not quite again, I don't know, I'm pretty sure that was developers that were playing the money in and they made mega money selling that. And then obviously they then moved Wimbledon to Milton Keynes and people wanted, I don't know, the people wanted a Wimbledon football club in Wimbledon, and I think there was a lot of that going on as well. 01:06:07:16 - 01:06:40:23 Speaker 2 So the council and everybody else was trying to try to basically get rid of sport that was involved in with petrol pollution. You had the, I bought the ultra low, though frequent ultra low emission zones and all the low emission zones coming in, which meant you couldn't get it, made it much more difficult for people to come in and, you know, with, with stock cars and with, and with speedway bikes. 01:06:41:02 - 01:07:03:13 Speaker 2 So and obviously with all this going on, I think there was a lot of, you know, the, the company that owned the stadium or the, the, the people that were only in the stadium as regards to the capital management people, they wanted to 01:07:03:15 - 01:07:26:15 Speaker 2 I wanted to make as much money out of the as possible. And so therefore, you know, they closed the, they closed the, they closed the, the, the, the speedway down. And then a few years later, they stopped the they stopped the dogs. 01:07:26:17 - 01:08:01:14 Speaker 2 They fuzed, I think, I can't remember went that way or the or they stopped the stocks before the, the these greyhounds but you know, so they stopped everything. So therefore this, this stadium became, you know, nothing. And they wanted to build it. They wanted to build on the, the car park because the car park where you see from here how much accommodation has gone in on that car park, you know, and, and they also, I mean, they, they also lost by doing that. 01:08:01:14 - 01:08:25:03 Speaker 2 They lost the, the sun, the Sunday sort of not jumble sales got car boot sales that were generating a lot of money for different things, but not enough to from, to sort of say, yeah, we want to keep it. And then obviously when Wimbledon had the big move to move movement and football club in here or FC Wimbledon, then that was the ideal sort of thing. 01:08:25:03 - 01:08:48:13 Speaker 2 So you know, again, I've got, you know, this is my opinion. It's not it's not you know, I don't know whether it's true. But I mean that's my opinion about what happened. I think it was all down to money personally. And if, if they wanted to keep, you know, if they wanted to keep sport in the area, they would have kept both of them. 01:08:48:15 - 01:09:03:23 Speaker 2 Not necessarily. You know, it's great. It's great. I have seen women have come back and it's great to see what they're doing now. But on the other hand, it's a it's a bitter pill as far as I'm concerned. 01:09:04:00 - 01:09:05:22 Speaker 1 Anything else. 01:09:05:24 - 01:09:18:05 Speaker 4 Just I wonder if you could describe a sort of a community or sense of community that built up within the fans and in the club? 01:09:18:06 - 01:09:51:03 Speaker 2 I think there was I think the community was mainly in the stadium. Obviously I can't say much from outside, but, well, you can say something outside because when, when people used to come to the stadium, I'm talking about both. Both periods was when you were talking about people coming to the stadium and going away from the stadium. As far as I know, there was no rowdiness. 01:09:51:05 - 01:10:11:23 Speaker 2 There might have been a few drunks, but, you know, not as much as what you can get. But it was it was an orderly sort of this way for the bus, this wait for the train. It's wait for, you know, it's walked down. It's walked down the road. Let's go back to two in Broadway Station. Let's go whichever way it was. 01:10:12:00 - 01:10:37:06 Speaker 2 And I think obviously, you know, later years there was a lot of cars around. So people were driving off and there was there was no big, no big deal about getting out of a car park. Well, that was a bit frustrating occasionally because we came by car a couple of times. What was the later years? But, it was yeah, it was good to do it. 01:10:37:06 - 01:10:58:04 Speaker 2 And I know sort of, you know, because I know in the later years I'm talking about the experience working. I was coming from Hammersmith, you know, you think in some nights it was the same night as Chelsea was on. I'm a Chelsea fan. And you going through, going through, going through a full and Broadway. You think, oh, what is this? 01:10:58:05 - 01:11:07:20 Speaker 2 What is this racket? Are you coming down here? And it's orderly. 01:11:07:22 - 01:11:20:23 Speaker 2 So I think that I don't ask you a question, but that, you know, that is to me the difference. I know my wife is totally anti football because of the crowds. I'm sorry. Because of the football.